I really do not understand ENFPs. | INFJ Forum

I really do not understand ENFPs.

Discussion in 'Relationships and Sociology' started by Honey, Dec 11, 2011.

Share This Page

Watchers:
This thread is being watched by 5 users.
More threads by Honey
  1. Honey

    Honey Regular Poster

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Threads:
    5
    Messages:
    96
    Likes Received:
    28
    Trophy Points:
    155
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    Enneagram:
    5w4
    Sorry in advance for the big wall of text here.

    For the past couple of months I have been working part-time in a temporary job where the supervisor most days is an ENFP, I started out liking and admiring this ENFP very much and hoped that through her I would develop a less strong dislike for the combination of Te, Ne, Fi, Si. However, yet again when relating to ENFPs, I have been left shocked, surprised, sad, confused and disappointed. She has done a number of things which I do not really understand and I feel extremely angry about.

    One of these things is that she got a fellow co-worker fired. The ENFP came up with a new system for doing one of the tasks this co-worker usually did but after trying the system, she told the ENFP that she would rather not use that system because it was causing problems, which it indeed was. The ENFP from that day forth started carrying all sorts of petty complaints to the managers and this eventually succeeded in getting the co-worker fired. The day the co-worker got fired, the ENFP sat around with her ISTJ best buddy (ENFPs/INFPs and XSTJs always seem to be able to find each other) and practically laughed about the co-worker being fired. She complained that the co-worker just made her feel bad and so she is glad she is gone.

    To me, this just seemed highly immoral (I often find ENFPs highly immoral, and not just morally different from me), she spared no thought for this women's personal interests or that the women was generally an excellent worker, she just cared that the woman had been critical of her or rather her prized system.

    This ENFP who is extremely popular and have lots of support from others then sought to get me fired shortly after that and just about succeeded (Sadly for me, I have been transferred to another department). Her attitude turned against me when the ENFP was trying to get another employee to do something that he thought might cause harm to himself professionally but which the ENFP thought would led lead to greater efficiency (this ENFP particular has very strong Te), I made the 'mistake' of agreeing with the other employee that what was being proposed did not seem to be a good idea... bad move on my part apparently. The ENFP also seemed to have been upset with me because I stopped trying to comfort/support her when she burst into tears about her job being stressful. The bursting into tears action was just too much for me to deal with after the sixth time in as many days. She wanted me to supervise the team because while she is extremely good at her job, she hated the stress/anxiety of supervising in a high pressure environment and wanted me to do it instead, I refused and the tears just seemed partially like manipulation to me.
    On my last day of the job last week, I would not even tell you what she said when I told her I was leaving, too much anger there.

    I understand not liking criticisms, not many people do, but in the face of it, ENFps just seem to become vengeful and self serving without regard for others and I have seen this in just about every ENFP I have had the misfortune of working with. I am just in awe of how far this ENFP would go to get rid of people who made her 'feel' uncomfortable. Their feelings just seem to be everything to them and while they claim to be live and let live people, it just never seem to work out that way in reality. I might be blinded by an ever growing dislike though and as a start to understanding ENFPs, I wonder:

    Can ENFPs/INFPs be consistently kind & empathetic to people who they do not like? Or do they consider expressing kindness under those circumstances to be somewhat fake?

    Do ENFPs generally reflect on the impact of their actions on people outside of their inner circle?

    Are ENFPs and INFPs rather prone to using information that people tell them in confidence against them in certain circumstances or just generally not knowing/not being able to judge when information they are told should remain in confidence?

    Also, to those who are very confident about being INFJs, do you ever have this strong sense that your personality is in deep conflict with that of ENFPs? Like your Ni clashes with their Ne but especially like your Fe/Ti is in strong conflict with their Fi/Te. What have you done that was helpful in managing this conflict? I really hate that I have not been able to get along with or trust any ENFP.
     
  2. skippy64

    skippy64 Community Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2011
    Threads:
    31
    Messages:
    358
    Likes Received:
    154
    Trophy Points:
    185
    MBTI:
    -
    Enneagram:
    -
    I think you have your head wrapped around letters too much. You confuse me with the "I" did this and "S" did that, then "TJ" made smirks to "FP" and "IJ" was all like, "no you di'int!"

    People are people. It doesn't matter of the personality, because not all ENFP's are going to behave exactly how this one you described. How do you even have it figured out what exactly each person's type is anyway?
     
  3. subwayrider

    subwayrider Into the White

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2011
    Threads:
    108
    Messages:
    2,637
    Likes Received:
    812
    Trophy Points:
    0
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    Enneagram:
    4w5
    ENFPs are weird.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  4. CAptain

    CAptain Of Truth and Reconciliation
    Donor

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2011
    Threads:
    11
    Messages:
    979
    Likes Received:
    279
    Trophy Points:
    0
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    Enneagram:
    4w5
    Haha! Yes, yes they are...but in a charismatic and awesome way. I used to have an internet buddy, I believe he was closest with the ENFP label but I wasn't sure so I asked him if he wanted to take a personality test but he refused! xD

    We used to rape noobs in MW2 while talking about the randomest thing. I miss him.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  5. subwayrider

    subwayrider Into the White

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2011
    Threads:
    108
    Messages:
    2,637
    Likes Received:
    812
    Trophy Points:
    0
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    Enneagram:
    4w5
    I miss using and hearing terms like that.

    Yeah. They are charismatic.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  6. Majesty

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2010
    Threads:
    53
    Messages:
    1,756
    Likes Received:
    508
    Trophy Points:
    657
    MBTI:
    ENTP
    It's almost impossible to dislike an ENFP. And that's VERY annoying. :(
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  7. AMM

    AMM Newbie

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2011
    Threads:
    3
    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    0
    MBTI:
    All and none
    Enneagram:
    0

    Agreed. Although I find the whole MBTI thing to be a somewhat accurate outline of people's overall tendencies and thought processes it is difficult to accept sweeping generalizations. There are too many idiosyncrasies and variables to consider when summing up a person's character and it is useful to keep in mind that no one is all bad or all good. Maybe this person's lack of empathy is the result of some sort of trauma or abuse. Of course I don't mean to make excuses for what your coworker did, it's obvious that she acted very selfishly but it may be possible that you are letting this get to you too much. People tend to make errors in judgement when their sense of self preservation is threatened.
     
  8. niffer

    niffer Well-known member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2011
    Threads:
    177
    Messages:
    8,031
    Featured Threads:
    3
    Likes Received:
    3,238
    Trophy Points:
    0
    MBTI:
    ESTP
    The two people I know to have been typed as ENFP that I've met IRL are assholes that are only concerned and able to have foresight into their own thoughts and feelings. These two guys make up the majority of the few peers of mine that I've ever felt contempt for. The known INFP that I know IRL I find hard to get along with sometimes too. I haven't talked to enough ENFPs (or INFPs, really) in depth online to be able to have much of an idea about these others who are supposedly like me.

    May I ask: Just how many supposed ENFPs have you encountered in real life, and how did you figure out their type?

    I'm not too in the know about typology and functions, but I think it's Fi that allows for a lot of fluidity in terms of morality. I know that I don't do things because I think of them as moral or immoral; rather, I appear to be moral because I genuinely want all others to be happy and will help them towards it, even if I don't like them (which is rare).

    The fact that this boss you mentioned had her mind closed to how her system was causing problems, wanted an employee to do something that would harm him professionally, and just was not accepting and taking consideration of other peoples opposing perspectives in the workplace, makes her sound foolish to me.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  9. knight in battle

    knight in battle Well-known member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2011
    Threads:
    125
    Messages:
    2,894
    Likes Received:
    543
    Trophy Points:
    682
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    Interesting. I talked to someone who self-identified as ENFP, and she could sense my emotional state easily, but we also tend to talk over each other.

    I've known two other women who I suspect are ENFPs. Very gregarious. Warm but sometimes I'm suspicious of their motives. A little too much enthusiasm for my tastes, though I appreciate their kind disposition in general.

    You can type someone by asking yourself in different situations whether a person is E or I, then S or N, etc. Two of the "easiest" letters to figure out are E/I and T/F. But when doubt sets in, I always compare their personality to Four Temperaments (SJ, NT, NF, SP). Usually, after that, I can pretty much produce the remaining two letters, based on MBTI descriptions. It's not an exact science, but it's nice to test out (via interaction/observation) whether a person is one type or another.

    But yes, people are people. I know an INFJ that I get along with... and two other INFJs who aren't really my closest friends - I wouldn't hate them, but I don't fully trust them either.
     
  10. knight in battle

    knight in battle Well-known member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2011
    Threads:
    125
    Messages:
    2,894
    Likes Received:
    543
    Trophy Points:
    682
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    Interesting. I think people are different, even if they're both ENFP. I don't think anyone is fully moral, and when I'm doing something just to appear moral or to fulfill other people's expectations, I know I'm not being genuine to myself (a supposedly strong NF value). When people around me are "moral" I tend to restrict my behaviors to conform to them ─ a pretty ugly thing to do for an NF. So I tend to withdraw from people if I feel like:

    1. There's nothing more I can do to mentor them (an NFJ trait).
    2. Their negative/critical side is too much for me to handle and isn't worth my getting to know them or help them.
    3. I feel constrained in my authentic behavior around them ─ which is almost everybody, some less than others.
     
  11. Trifoilum

    Trifoilum find wisdom, build hope.

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2009
    Threads:
    197
    Messages:
    6,555
    Featured Threads:
    2
    Likes Received:
    1,711
    Trophy Points:
    380
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    Enneagram:
    6w5
    One thing we have to consider here is the chance of meeting the worse members of this particular group of MBTI.

    Another is..the situation itself; the workplace, and most importantly, how it affect them emotionally. Fi doms and auxs are the most emotionally sensitive bunches in the group in general; and that Fi could drive them to do drastic things if they feel they are being wronged in an enormous way. (How drastic they are depends on each person of course)
    Fake. From what I noticed, Fi users generally have less adaptability and defense towards 'etiquette' or being 'nice' when they don't feel like it. Thus if they don't like something, they may or may not be covert about it, but they will express it in some way or another.

    No idea, but in my personal case; no.
    I'm mostly seeing NeFi in this aspect as "The world, and how it affects me"; that could make them look self-conceited and self-centered, or that could make them look devoted. I have no idea.


    Know two; three ENFPs so far; all of them are somewhat problematic. Too flighty; too-- lacking -- resilience. Sometimes it feels like what they see in the world is all about them and what happened to them; sometimes it feels like they're using a heavy dose of victim mentality...or (verily obvious and grating) manipulations to get what they want, etc.

    I stand back, mostly. :| Definitely won't try to 'sway' them in any way.

    I think a lot of ENFPs are great people; I just saw the worse of them, and I tell what I saw simply.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
  12. namiasdf

    namiasdf Newbie

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2011
    Threads:
    6
    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    0
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    Enneagram:
    Social Type 3
    I understand completely.
    We as INFJ are extremely empathetic. It's why I can't watch movies with suffering (i.e. horror movies).
    The thing is, you're sort of basing how you identify people in the world as this four letter code.
    See them objectively as that type of person, because it sounds like you're making generalizations, to me at least.

    I see that mostly as a personal issue that the person has some latent insecurity issues, which allows her to be so vicious and full of malice for her fellow "lady".



    ** Just as a side question. They're both feeling portraits, but INFJ's are extremely empathetic, and ENFP's as per this post are supposedly very lacking in empathy. What explains this inconsistency? Is it the being introverted, or is it a result of being perceptive instead of judging? Neither lead me to believe that an ENFP are universally empathy lacking people.
     
  13. Arzoo

    Arzoo One

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2019
    Threads:
    0
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    431
    MBTI:
    ENFP
    I feel there is a grave misunderstanding here because I am an ENFP too. ENFPs work better if someone give them a larger grid to focus on. For example, religion provides me with a strong structure that helps me focus. Another weakness of ENFPs is that they can get focused about their goals and forget everything else. How many times and by whom they have been abused in the past play a strong role in how their character develops. If you want your boss to be your friend, get her distracted by things that she might like She might slowly change into a nicer person this way. ENFPs are just stubborn people but they are not pushy. You stand up for what you feel is right and ENFPs will eventually listen to you. And yes! ENFPs are nice to people who are outside their circle as well. They are actually very sensitive and layered people so it might seem like they have these large walls around them. Walls are there to help them control their energy levels. If this person is too energetic and rudely walking on everyone's faces and chest, then somehow isolate her from her daily routine. Make her sit and meditate somewhere. Its easier for ENFPs to change this way. I know this all from experience. I used to be snobby and annoying too; but, I worked on this slowly.
     
    Sandie33 likes this.
  14. ClevelandINTP

    ClevelandINTP Permanent Fixture

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2018
    Threads:
    4
    Messages:
    1,320
    Featured Threads:
    4
    Likes Received:
    1,995
    Trophy Points:
    1,077
    MBTI:
    INTP
    Enneagram:
    7, 4, 8 and2
    This. And, they know it.

    Just keep in perspective that you are not so special and they do that stuff to everyone.

    They also seem to enjoy power and not being settled. They’re also pretty paranoid and insecure
     
    Sandie33 likes this.
  15. Pin

    Pin "Magnificent Bastard" / Ren's Counterpart

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2017
    Threads:
    0
    Messages:
    7,781
    Likes Received:
    27,572
    Trophy Points:
    2,877
    MBTI:
    ENTJ
    Enneagram:
    3w4, 3-8-7
    Neither do I, I'm on this forum for a reason.
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Wyote, Sandie33 and neko like this.
  16. Asa

    Asa Resident palindrome

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2015
    Threads:
    75
    Messages:
    4,722
    Featured Threads:
    23
    Likes Received:
    25,119
    Trophy Points:
    1,831
    Gender:
    Female
    MBTI:
    INFJ
    I know only one ENFP who enjoys MBTI enough to bother identifying himself. He was a comedy writer for a major political TV show. He's incredibly entertaining and charismatic, knowledgable, and also instinctually knows how to be serious and quiet in a way that makes him easy for introverts to get along with. I have never felt uncomfortable around him.

    In most cases of poor behavior, such as the OP described, I find that the person of said type is immature or unhealthy. Sometimes types just clash, but being nasty to each other is caused by an imbalance, or a catalyst (like politics, or a bad past with each other.)
     
    Stop hovering to collapse... Click to collapse... Hover to expand... Click to expand...
    Wyote and Sandie33 like this.
Loading...

Share This Page