Donald Trump and Nice Guy hatred | INFJ Forum

Donald Trump and Nice Guy hatred

MrWonka

MrWonka

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Mar 2, 2016
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First let me just say that I do not consider myself to be a Nice Guy or a "Nice Guy" however you tend to view it. However I do find the hatred of so called nice guys and the idea that "Nice guys finish last" to be some what hilarious. As I've gotten older I've noticed this hatred of those who present themselves as good people in favor of perceived honest assholes to be much more pervasive throughout society and particularly troubling. The most obvious of which you find in the rise of Donald Trump as the republican party leading nomination. There's this perception that politicians like President Obama, Hillary Clinton, Marco Rubio, Boehner, and the rest of the republican establishment are all just liars who will tell you what you want to hear, but they are letting the country descend into hell once they have taken office. Whereas Trump may come across as an asshole, but he can afford to because he's honest and he's telling like it is. The reality of course is that virtually nothing that Trump says is the truth and he's just a bloated asshole. It reminds me of these women who are so sick of their parents and their friends attempts to control them and treat them like a helpless flower that they are driven even further into in the arms of an abusive boyfriend.

Certainly there are those men who will be nice at the outset only to turn into shit heads in the end, and certainly there are politicians who will tell you what you want to hear it seems like rather than try and figure out which decent human beings truly have your best interest at heart many would rather throw their lot in with a complete piece of garbage because "hey, at least I know where I stand with him" even if where you're standing with them is an absolutely horrible place.
 
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In an atmosphere of political ideologues, how can a pragmatist convincingly demonstrate that he is no ideologue?

Trump's approach certainly leaves no room for doubt.

I don't think people who support him are going to be surprised if he lies, because I think it is pretty clear is not out to sell a version of truth.
 
Flavus Aquila said:
I don't think people who support him are going to be surprised if he lies, because I think it is pretty clear is not out to sell a version of truth.
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Sure he is. The version of the truth he wants to sell is that of himself as a winner and a savior and to paint anyone who opposes him as a loser or a danger to the country. That is an image he has created far more than it is actually who he is.
 
They're all lying through their teeth just to get into power.
 
MrWonka said:
Sure he is. The version of the truth he wants to sell is that of himself as a winner and a savior and to paint anyone who opposes him as a loser or a danger to the country. That is an image he has created far more than it is actually who he is.
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I think it is his primary method of deflecting forms of criticism, hard-hitting questions and intellectual challenge.
 
MrWonka said:
Sure he is. The version of the truth he wants to sell is that of himself as a winner and a savior and to paint anyone who opposes him as a loser or a danger to the country. That is an image he has created far more than it is actually who he is.
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I suppose it may just be vanity, but in this instance I think it is more pragmatic than simple vainglory. He's got his finger on the pulse and knows that kind of vanity could carry him over the line.

I am somewhat indifferent to the elections in your neck of the woods, but I suspect that should Trump be elected, he might actually be a good president, ONLY if the notion of ideological/moral/etc. leadership is disassociated from the assessment. My personal tastes are such that I don't care for government that acts like an NGO, but that's neither here nor there.
 
Peppermint said:
They're all lying through their teeth just to get into power.
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Mhm. It's absurd to think any of them are "decent human beings." You don't get that far in business or politics by being decent.
 
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JJJA said:
I think it is his primary method of deflecting forms of criticism, hard-hitting questions and intellectual challenge.
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Hard question. Choose a response:


  1. Everybody loves me
  2. I wrote Art of the Deal
  3. Everything is negotiable
  4. I make deals
  5. I've got the best words
 
MrWonka said:
Sure he is. The version of the truth he wants to sell is that of himself as a winner and a savior and to paint anyone who opposes him as a loser or a danger to the country. That is an image he has created far more than it is actually who he is.
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Well, can you blame any politician for saying that he'll do a better job (ie save us from sure ruin) than the other guy? His rhetorical style is perhaps bullying, but at this point, it makes no difference to me if someone is a covert or overt bully.
 
Ok this is a pseudo Trump + other thread so... It says "Nice guy" and rather than make another thread I just want to say I just heard that Carson while not officially suspending his campaign essentially is. Im pretty sad about this because while he seemed low energy he was the only candidate to maintain an honest and thoughtful campaign. He didnt reduce himself to attacking other candidates. He responded with thoughtful responses and clearly had the honest desire of making America great again rather than to be President just to be President.
I maintained hope that people would chose him over the other sideshow going on. I maintained hope people would start thinking it would be a good idea to have a thinking President with Americas best interest in mind in office finally.
 
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Eventhorizon said:
Ok this is a pseudo Trump + other thread so... It says "Nice guy" and rather than make another thread I just want to say I just heard that Carson while not officially suspending his campaign essentially is. Im pretty sad about this because while he seemed low energy he was the only candidate to maintain an honest and thoughtful campaign. He didnt reduce himself to attacking other candidates. He responded with thoughtful responses and clearly had the honest desire of making America great again rather than to be President just to be President.
I maintained hope that people would chose him over the other sideshow going on. I maintained hope people would start thinking it would be a good idea to have a thinking President with Americas best interest in mind in office finally.
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he had some of the worst numbers. It pretty much never left the ground. I really had hopes for Rubio out of the GOP, but looks like Trump casts a long shadow.
 
rawr said:
he had some of the worst numbers. It pretty much never left the ground. I really had hopes for Rubio out of the GOP, but looks like Trump casts a long shadow.
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Looked like he was gaining ground for a while. I maintained hope. He was my favorite candidate. But.. you can only say so many odd things and look like you lack energy for so long. Im bummed about it but in the end I guess its not unexpected.

I like(d) Rubio as well but I really wanted to see a nonestablishment candidate take it in the long run to send a message to the GOP (not Trump obviously).
 
Eventhorizon said:
Looked like he was gaining ground for a while. I maintained hope. He was my favorite candidate. But.. you can only say so many odd things and look like you lack energy for so long. Im bummed about it but in the end I guess its not unexpected.

I like(d) Rubio as well but I really wanted to see a nonestablishment candidate take it in the long run to send a message to the GOP (not Trump obviously).
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I agree. I feel like any of those would have been better than Trump but Cruz kinda makes me nervous. Rubio seemed like a safer more moderate bet. It's sad that our debates and elections depend so much on energy and performance rather than policy and views, but i guess if you stay in the background like Carson and don't really get attention, no one's going to really pay attention to your policies and you get no traction. He was a bit of an odd one though. Seems like Trump is all show and entertainment, no consistency or conviction other than to make a deal.
 
rawr said:
I agree. I feel like any of those would have been better than Trump but Cruz kinda makes me nervous. Rubio seemed like a safer more moderate bet. It's sad that our debates and elections depend so much on energy and performance rather than policy and views, but i guess if you stay in the background like Carson and don't really get attention, no one's going to really pay attention to your policies and you get no traction. He was a bit of an odd one though. Seems like Trump is all show and entertainment, no consistency or conviction other than to make a deal.
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Maybe Trump is just what Americans understand better... entertainment.
 
Eventhorizon said:
Maybe Trump is just what Americans understand better... entertainment.
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well American Idol lasted for how many seasons? People love that 'reality' TV stuff. Trump just makes it too easy.
 
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