[PAX] Adoption and parenting rights mothers vs. fathers -- sexist?

[Soulful]

I was reading through BC's adoption page, and came across information that surprised me:

How long do birth parents have to change their minds?Once the consents to the adoption have been signed, the birth father may revoke his consent until the time that the child is placed in the adoptive home. Additionally, the birth mother has 30 days after the birth of the child to revoke her consent. Apart from that, anyone who has consented may only revoke his/her consent if the court finds it to be in the child's "best interest."

Is this sexist? Or is providing a womb for a child for up to 9 months, giving birth, and having the huge gamut of hormonal changes and other physical changes just reason for giving birth mothers more time?
Would any parents mind chipping in?
@Cindylou, @Sriracha , @Norton , @Jill Hives ,

All are welcome to discuss. Please no attacks.

 

[Gaze]

This is a complicated relationship. There are cases of this where the birth mother uses the last minute revocation as a way to get more cash from the adoptive parents. I don't think it's a black and white issue. Also, the bonding phase between parent and child varies. Not everyone bonds with their kids right away. A mother who feels very disconnected after birth, which may be due to post partum depression, may later develop an interest in wanting to build a relationship with her child. A father who may feel unsure of whether he wants kids, may later decide he wants a chance to be a parent. Not to ignore the rights of the adoptive parents of course, but this is why I don't think adoption is a cure all. New parents need time to figure things out. Giving them these preset time to make a decision is not really a fair choice. Makes me think of all the parents who regretted adoption, despite economic struggles, and later thought, if they only had more time to adjust to the thought of being a parent, maybe they would've tried rather than be pummelled with the idea that "adoption is always in the best interest of the child".

 

[Air]

I don't believe that either birth parent should be able to re-neg after the papers are signed.

 

[Soulful]

I don't believe that either birth parent should be able to re-neg after the papers are signed.

Even if they are signed before the birth?

 

[5r6jhd]

No, I beleive that it is completely fair. Most countries have similar laws to this.

I'm a single mother and I did the entire pregnancy on my own. It was a really difficult, lonely, isolated time. I was really sick for most of my pregnancy and suffered from massive hormone changes. Seriously, never understimate a pregnant womans hormones. I considered adoption about half way through my pregnancy, but fortunately for me I had a strong love of my child already and I knew deep down I really didn't want to give her up. Fear of the unknown is a really powerful thing.

I have had a couple of friends since been in situations where contraception failed them and the fathers did not react well to the thought of baby. It's the scariest thing in the world finding yourself alone and unexpectedly pregnant. One friend of mine in particular (who suffers from a mood disorder) also had massive mood swings and spent hours upon hours in her later stages of pregnancy talking to me about how scared she was and prepping for adoption. Having been there, I knew most likely the baby would arrive and all these fears would disappear. I was right, and now she is the happiest and best mummy in the world.

With laws like these, prospective adoptive parents are aware of the risks they are taking...they should be going into it with an open mind aware of what could happen.I am all in favor of birth mothers rights and don't believe a woman should be punished based on the cruelty of severe hormonal changes and descions made in the unknown (prior to birth). If anyone here is a parent, they know that everything completely changes once that tiny little person comes into the world.

 

[5r6jhd]

Also, regarding what Cedar said...that is really complicated. I think it's different for those in the US and us here in Ireland. I think there is a lot more to consider in the US as in Ireland a lot is covered under welfare. I was reasearching our laws here, as it's been closer to 3 years since I was in the position to research. From what I remember from my research back then, mothers had a few months after the birth to change their minds.

This is what I've currently found on adoptionin Ireland

Consent
The consent of the parent/guardian of the child to the adoption is a legal requirement. If the child is born outside marriage, and the father has no guardianship rights, only the mother's consent is needed. Under the adoption legislation , however, birth fathers are now being consulted (if possible) about the adoption of their children. In situations where the parents are not married and the father does not have guardianship rights, his consent is not necessary for adoption. However, the consent of the father is required if he marries the mother after the birth of the child or he is appointed guardian or is granted custody of the child by court order.

The mother, father (where he is guardian) or other legal guardian must give an initial consent or agreement to the placing of a child for adoption by an approved adoption service. He/she must then give his/her consent to the making of an Adoption Order. This consent may be withdrawn any time before the making of the Adoption Order.

If the mother either refuses consent or withdraws consent already given, the adopting parents may apply to the High Court for an order. If the court is satisfied that it is in the best interests of the child, it will make an order giving custody of the child to the adopting parents for a specified period and authorising the Adoption Authority to dispense with the mother's consent to the making of the Adoption Order.

If a mother changes her mind about adoption before the making of the Adoption Order, but the adopting parents refuse to give up the child, she may then institute legal proceedings to have custody of her child returned to her.

When an Adoption Order is made, a new birth certificate can be obtained for the child. Although it is not an actual birth certificate, it has the status of one for legal purposes. It gives the date of the Adoption Order and the names and addresses of the adoptive parents and is similar in all aspects to a birth certificate.

The procedure involved in adopting a child is thorough and takes time, at least a year. When you have contacted your local HSE Adoption Service, you will be invited to attend an information session along with other interested couples, to learn what is involved in the adoption process. If you want to proceed, you ask for the relevant forms to be sent out.

I think in the event of adoptive parents giving birth mothers money, it is fairly messy. I know in America sometimes adoptive parents are willing to pay for medical costs etc? Are there any laws on that kind of thing? Here in Ireland we have public care, so everyone is entitled to free care in the case of pregnancy and births.

 

[CindyLou]

No, I beleive that it is completely fair. Most countries have similar laws to this.

I'm a single mother and I did the entire pregnancy on my own. It was a really difficult, lonely, isolated time. I was really sick for most of my pregnancy and suffered from massive hormone changes. Seriously, never understimate a pregnant womans hormones. I considered adoption about half way through my pregnancy, but fortunately for me I had a strong love of my child already and I knew deep down I really didn't want to give her up. Fear of the unknown is a really powerful thing.

I have had a couple of friends since been in situations where contraception failed them and the fathers did not react well to the thought of baby. It's the scariest thing in the world finding yourself alone and unexpectedly pregnant. One friend of mine in particular (who suffers from a mood disorder) also had massive mood swings and spent hours upon hours in her later stages of pregnancy talking to me about how scared she was and prepping for adoption. Having been there, I knew most likely the baby would arrive and all these fears would disappear. I was right, and now she is the happiest and best mummy in the world.

With laws like these, prospective adoptive parents are aware of the risks they are taking...they should be going into it with an open mind aware of what could happen.I am all in favor of birth mothers rights and don't believe a woman should be punished based on the cruelty of severe hormonal changes and descions made in the unknown (prior to birth). If anyone here is a parent, they know that everything completely changes once that tiny little person comes into the world.

I do not have a mood disorder (that I'm aware) but I do not believe I am the same person after pregnancy and childbirth. I look back on the person before and it's another person. Bizarrrrre. I always thought that stuff was nonsense until I went through it myself.

I think 30 days is fine. Hell, you can change your mind after you buy a car; you ought to be given 30 days to reconsider giving away your baby.

 

[Sriracha]

I think you will find laws regarding custody over history have favored the mother; however, so many of these laws are changing because they see the father as an equal party in raising a child. I don't think I have ever seen another period in time where fathers have been diving into domestic duties. You see fathers as stay at home parents, etc. I think the other thing you have to consider and I'm not certain about BC law, but in the state of GA, a father has no rights to a child if the child was born while he was not married to the other party. If this is the case, he will need to petition the court to "legitimate" the child, and if the mother opposes to the petition a paternity test will have to be established. Most women in this case will not oppose, because legitimization also means securing child support if they are keeping the child. This could be a long process. If we say hypothetically this is the case in BC while adoption is taking place, the law recognizes that a baby needs consistent caregivers right away. You can't say "ok we will put this baby on pause until the paperwork is done." lol

From this article, the father and mother still have consent to revoke after their "grace period" is finished. They would be included in the "anyone" as the right to revoke which is to be investigated by the court. Then you have to ask, what kind of court do you have? Who will the judge favor? Is the judge fair?

Where I live, the parents have only 10 days after signing to revoke the paperwork (this includes whether or not the father is legitimate.) This is actually what one of my CASA cases is about. The parents revoked the paperwork and then tried to extort more money from the adoptive parents. Law enforcement saw this as trying to "sell a baby" when the adoptive parents sought their help, thus placing the child in state custody.

 

[Air]

Even if they are signed before the birth?

What I am referring to is birth mothers who essentially change their mind and snatch the baby right back out of the adoptive parents hands. And yes, it does happen.