A Perspective on Altruism

[54192&#cmy]

Hello there, fellow INFJs and others.
Let's have a talk on one of our most famous traits, the thing we delight in the most: Altruism.
I think that in a normal conventional sense, humans don't find the need to tend to the needs of others, and so when they actually do tend to the needs of others, they deem that action as altruistic and give it unusual weightage, as using your mental energy and helping someone putting strain on yourself isn't something that everyone does.
They deem that action very special when they do it once and get a boost in their self esteem. But this boost is only gained if they get the desired acknowledgement for their work.
But then, as time passes, they keep stretching themselves with the expectation of an acknowledgement, but sooner or later are hit by the painful realization that their actions are being taken for granted, and is no longer looked upon as too different a tendency. When their altruistic action isn't given the unusual weightage by others (the unusual weightage that they give their own actions), their self esteem levels fluctuate and they feel angry and somewhat cheated that despite investing their resources, they didn't get the reward they feel that they deserve. This turns them back to being the "normal" non-altruistic human being that they were.
These kind of people are the same people who wonder how Mahatma Gandhi, Martin Luther King Jr and Nelson Mandela were so highly altruistic.
More than high altruism, they are more curious about how their altruism is so consistent
This is where my theory comes in
I believe for the people who indulge in too much altruism, if they really want to keep their altruism levels consistent, their self esteem levels must remain consistent. Now, because of the normal response to the "lack of acknowledgement", this self esteem levels drops and as soon as it drops, the desire of getting the satisfaction from the help reduces and ultimately stops. To keep self esteem levels consistent, the highly altruistic people need to do something else.
Their only way of keeping their self esteem levels consistent is (according to my theory)
to consider themselves at a far higher moral ground than a normal person. There might be more that I don't know of.

Umm I could disagree. One who is truly worried about people cares not if they get rewards for it. Just doing the work is the reward. A true believer needs no faith. They do for the sake of doing. I would be very leery of any person who expects praise or gets some type kick to their self esteem. Self esteem means nothing when one is doing selfless acts.....

 

[Retro]

I personally believe in the joy of performing good, altruistic actions. But it should not be an self-focused kind of pleasure derived from the action; rather the pure joy of the soul fulfilling itself in doing what is best for it to do. Attaining the highest excellence in virtue does feature, in my mind, a certain kind of joy. This is how I understand Aristotle's saying: "The ideal man takes joy in doing favors for others."

It's not joy of the ego, but joy of the soul.

My idealogy recently underwent a change. If we only rely on ego to keep altruism consistent, there can again be a point or an incident or something similar which can shatter that ego and make you go haywire. Your opinion on this seems to be far better, as fulfillment of your soul can be one of the best things you can do for yourself

 

[wolly.green]

Hello there, fellow INFJs and others.
Let's have a talk on one of our most famous traits, the thing we delight in the most: Altruism.
I think that in a normal conventional sense, humans don't find the need to tend to the needs of others, and so when they actually do tend to the needs of others, they deem that action as altruistic and give it unusual weightage, as using your mental energy and helping someone putting strain on yourself isn't something that everyone does.
They deem that action very special when they do it once and get a boost in their self esteem. But this boost is only gained if they get the desired acknowledgement for their work.
But then, as time passes, they keep stretching themselves with the expectation of an acknowledgement, but sooner or later are hit by the painful realization that their actions are being taken for granted, and is no longer looked upon as too different a tendency. When their altruistic action isn't given the unusual weightage by others (the unusual weightage that they give their own actions), their self esteem levels fluctuate and they feel angry and somewhat cheated that despite investing their resources, they didn't get the reward they feel that they deserve. This turns them back to being the "normal" non-altruistic human being that they were.
These kind of people are the same people who wonder how Mahatma Gandhi, Martin Luther King Jr and Nelson Mandela were so highly altruistic.
More than high altruism, they are more curious about how their altruism is so consistent
This is where my theory comes in
I believe for the people who indulge in too much altruism, if they really want to keep their altruism levels consistent, their self esteem levels must remain consistent. Now, because of the normal response to the "lack of acknowledgement", this self esteem levels drops and as soon as it drops, the desire of getting the satisfaction from the help reduces and ultimately stops. To keep self esteem levels consistent, the highly altruistic people need to do something else.
Their only way of keeping their self esteem levels consistent is (according to my theory)
to consider themselves at a far higher moral ground than a normal person. There might be more that I don't know of.

Hi Retro!

Perhaps. But consider, for instance, the individual that is motivated to be altruistic because of feelings of guilt, shame, love, empathy and so on. If that individual hears a dog screeching in pain, is he going to help because he wants gratification? What about if he sees his friend spiraling into a depression? Is he motivated by gratification? Of course not. He is motivated by a deep urge; a strong instinct to help! This urge to help is a deep animal instinct that exists, regardless of whether we seek or find gratification. And it will not go away because of low self esteem.

Im sorry if that sounds harsh. I just felt like I needed to say something.

 

[Retro]

It

Hi Retro!

Perhaps. But consider, for instance, the individual that is motivated to be altruistic because of feelings of guilt, shame, love, empathy and so on. If that individual hears a dog screeching in pain, is he going to help it because he want gratification? What about if he sees his friend spiraling into a depression? Is he motivated gratification? Of course not. He is motivated by a deep urge; a strong instinct to help! This urge to help is a deep animal instinct that exists, regardless of whether we seek or find gratification. And it will not go away because of low self esteem.

Im sorry if that sounds harsh. I just felt like I needed to say something.

It doesn't sound harsh. But my theory on self esteem doesn't seek gratification from others. It seeks the ability of self gratification. You are convinced that you performed a good deed which increases your self esteem. You boost this self esteem by considering yourself on a morally higher ground to keep the actions consistent, irrespective of whether you are appreciated for your good deeds or not

 

[flufiang]

I

I'm a Taoist, and the Tao teaches us that morally good actions done for self-esteem are not wholly good because it's not about helping people, it's about pleasing yourself. To quote Taoist thinking directly:
"If you feel regret doing evil, then there is some good in evil. If you rejoice in doing good, then there is some evil in good."

I agree with this..... true altruism is doing a good deed and not expecting anything in return..... if you’re expecting a reward back (other than feeling within yourself that you’ve done good) then I’d say it’s an agenda based action.... you do something hoping for a certain outcome which would benefit you as well....

 

[flufiang]

It

It doesn't sound harsh. But my theory on self esteem doesn't seek gratification from others. It seeks the ability of self gratification. You are convinced that you performed a good deed which increases your self esteem. You boost this self esteem by considering yourself on a morally higher ground to keep the actions consistent, irrespective of whether you are appreciated for your good deeds or not

I think remaining humble walks hand in hand with true altruism

 

[Reason]

I

I agree with this..... true altruism is doing a good deed and not expecting anything in return..... if you’re expecting a reward back (other than feeling within yourself that you’ve done good) then I’d say it’s an agenda based action.... you do something hoping for a certain outcome which would benefit you as well....

The Taoist perspective is that feeling good about helping people is detrimental though, the thinking is that you would just naturally help people in trouble as a sort of... Reflex I guess is the word I'm looking for?

If you're helping people to feel good about yourself then you're really just helping yourself aren't you?

 

[flufiang]

The Taoist perspective is that feeling good about helping people is detrimental though, the thinking is that you would just naturally help people in trouble as a sort of... Reflex I guess is the word I'm looking for?

If you're helping people to feel good about yourself then you're really just helping yourself aren't you?

Ah so what this boils down to is intent.... if your intention is to help because it makes you feel good then yes, I’d say selflessness has been tainted, however if you help someone purely because you are in a position to do so, and the by product is that you feel good afterwards then I’d classify it as a true act of altruism....

 

[Reason]

Ah so what this boils down to is intent.... if your intention is to help because it makes you feel good then yes, I’d say selflessness has been tainted, however if you help someone purely because you are in a position to do so, and the by product is that you feel good afterwards then I’d classify it as a true act of altruism....

I think you reach the true state of altruism when you move from good deed to good deed and don't dwell on it or even notice that you did it. Like I say it can become a kind of reflex.

 

[flufiang]

Ah so what this boils down to is intent.... if your intention is to help because it makes you feel good then yes, I’d say selflessness has been tainted, however if you help someone purely because you are in a position to do so, and the by product is that you feel good afterwards then I’d classify it as a true act of altruism....

Ah so what this boils down to is intent.... if your intention is to help because it makes you feel good then yes, I’d say selflessness has been tainted, however if you help someone purely because you are in a position to do so, and the by product is that you feel good afterwards then I’d classify it as a true act of altr

I think you reach the true state of altruism when you move from good deed to good deed and don't dwell on it or even notice that you did it. Like I say it can become a kind of reflex.

Perhaps true altruism can also be defined by the level of sacrifice.... I think the hardest and perhaps most defining part of being truly altruistic is when it requires self sacrifice for the benefit of another..... but I do hear you, you’re looking at it from a big picture perspective where I’m looking at it from a singular case perspective.... I mean ultimately, in an ideal world, we’d all reach that point where doing good was just a way of living, nothing spectacular.... just the way it is....

 

[Kabss]

Hello there, fellow INFJs and others.
Let's have a talk on one of our most famous traits, the thing we delight in the most: Altruism.
I think that in a normal conventional sense, humans don't find the need to tend to the needs of others, and so when they actually do tend to the needs of others, they deem that action as altruistic and give it unusual weightage, as using your mental energy and helping someone putting strain on yourself isn't something that everyone does.
They deem that action very special when they do it once and get a boost in their self esteem. But this boost is only gained if they get the desired acknowledgement for their work.
But then, as time passes, they keep stretching themselves with the expectation of an acknowledgement, but sooner or later are hit by the painful realization that their actions are being taken for granted, and is no longer looked upon as too different a tendency. When their altruistic action isn't given the unusual weightage by others (the unusual weightage that they give their own actions), their self esteem levels fluctuate and they feel angry and somewhat cheated that despite investing their resources, they didn't get the reward they feel that they deserve. This turns them back to being the "normal" non-altruistic human being that they were.
These kind of people are the same people who wonder how Mahatma Gandhi, Martin Luther King Jr and Nelson Mandela were so highly altruistic.
More than high altruism, they are more curious about how their altruism is so consistent
This is where my theory comes in
I believe for the people who indulge in too much altruism, if they really want to keep their altruism levels consistent, their self esteem levels must remain consistent. Now, because of the normal response to the "lack of acknowledgement", this self esteem levels drops and as soon as it drops, the desire of getting the satisfaction from the help reduces and ultimately stops. To keep self esteem levels consistent, the highly altruistic people need to do something else.
Their only way of keeping their self esteem levels consistent is (according to my theory)
to consider themselves at a far higher moral ground than a normal person. There might be more that I don't know of.

I think that there are many many altruistic instances in our life that we think deserve more acknowledgement-the thing is ,a person who u r helping may not acknowledge ur deed but it influences mind of people around you-ones who saw your effort;By doing this,you are benefiting the society as a whole and just a person’s acknowledgment doesn’t matter anymore. I remember once i was traveling in this San Francisco tram and,as my destination was kinda far away,and the tram was full;So,i frequently used to get up so that elderly ppl or in my case-everyone who’s not a teenager- could sit.I don’t think most of them even thanked me for this but as i reached my stop ,a lady thanked me for setting an example for her kids who saw me put my efforts in order to help those ppl. So,basically,Knowing that i had influenced someone’s mind in a good way made my day ! Somehow,ppl will get to know what you have done ,and you sure will recieve some blessings i suppose ?(I mean if u aren’t an atheist like me ,blessings sure)