Recognizing and dealing with our shadow | Page 2 | INFJ Forum

Recognizing and dealing with our shadow

Seraphim said:
Both of these are shadows. But maybe it varies from person to person, which one is the repulsive one and which one is the attractive one.
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You brought up a good point Seraphim. Maybe it depends on the INFJ on which two types they feel repulsed and attracted to. But I definitely don't get that much along with ENFP's. At first I'm attracted to them(I've dated a couple of them) but after some weeks, I can't absolutely stand them. And don't get me wrong, I think they're great people but on a more personal relationship, it's very hard for me to form some kind of bond.
 
Last Dawn said:
You brought up a good point Seraphim. Maybe it depends on the INFJ on which two types they feel repulsed and attracted to. But I definitely don't get that much along with ENFP's. At first I'm attracted to them(I've dated a couple of them) but after some weeks, I can't absolutely stand them. And don't get me wrong, I think they're great people but on a more personal relationship, it's very hard for me to form some kind of bond.
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Aaaaaah... hmm... Interesting! XD I find that from direct interaction with several people.... I can't stand not only those two, but 3 kind of people in different ways; ENFP, ESTJ, and ESTP.

Analyzing them...*

ENFP (code-flipped) : I despise their .....perceived need to get along with everyone. To the extent of somewhat serving...and sometimes, not out of compassion or sympathy, but out of...... the fear to be hated.

Of course, this is a shadow projection and reflecting back on myself, I -do- have that need, and I can be too much a servant out of "oooh no I don't want to be hated" and no, I don't feel too proud about it.

ESTP (order-flipped) : I despise them the least. But my alarm is always ringing. I can't guess their needs / wants / philosophies, and they're.... a smooth talker, and that makes me highly suspicious on them.

And then I realized I -admire- that; at least the extroverted, highly expressive yet 'hidden' aspect of them, and...I guess this is my golden shadow.

Now, the weird part is ESTJ. TO be honest, one I've lived with is pretty much patronizing and..I understand but don't get his way of thinking, don't want to get his way of thinking, and certainly wouldn't want to follow that.

And then VH's post in the ESTJ topic enlightens me:

VH said:
That's because you have diametrically opposite cognitive functions.

As an INFJ, you have Ni > Fe > Ti > Se

As an ESTJ, he has Te > Si > Ne > Fi

Not only do you have a different scale (N>F>T>S vs T>S>N>F), you have an opposing pace (i>e>i>e vs e>i>e>i) as well as completely opposite functions (Ni vs Ne, Fe vs Fi, Ti vs Te, Se vs Si).

This is a very strenuous set of differences to overcome.
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O.M.G. Is this another case ? >_<

Of...course, I'm aware of the personal bias; that this might be personal / only concerning a person (to be honest I never met any open-and-blatant ESTJ) and the fact that I was once (and still, in certain ways) an INFP.

*Disclaimer : stereotyping+generalizing here. There's a high possibilities that the people I've met are bad / underdeveloped version of the MBTI.
 
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Last Dawn said:
So pretty much you're saying that all your other functions still have a mixture of your dominant function integrated in them? For example, when your Fi lights up, it's still under the dominance and perspective of your Ti?

Correct me if I'm wrong
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It's not to say that a function is under the dominion of another.

It's more like:

for any given experience or moment, there's a mixture of all the functions happening in tandem. The dominant one of course is seen and used the most. but if you take a single moment carefully, you'll see that there are other functions that exists in the background as well.

If you looked at your room and I asked you to count all the green items in the room, you'd start counting. And when you're ready, I'll ask you to tell me how many blue items you saw.

The dominant functions are there because that's where your focus/MO is, but the other stuff is always there, but not in focus.

Some moments are dry, other moments are filled with a symphony of thoughts and emotions. But not a single moment is 100% one function or another. It's really about where your focus is.

Once I was aware of this, I'm now able to choose my responses to the world. I'd venture to say that it's the same concept as the little voice in your head, or a gut reaction, or the like.

Another way to look at is to think of a community of 8 people in your head. Some is names Ti, others are Se Si Fe etc. Each one has a separate voice and in some cases, the people talk together and there's a mixture for thoughts and ideas. Other times, it's hard counter balance that's proposed and the person would feel guilt to a cognitive pull or dissonance. For example, a girl is trying to loose weight to a fit a dress, however she always take 10 mins to stare at a cake. Stuff like this.

Under analysis, it's helpful t see things individually, but it really is a mixture of functions than happen most of the time.
 
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Last Dawn said:
In my opinion, our real shadow isn't really the ESTP, but rather the ENFP in MBTI terms. I think this because if you look closely, we share no cognitive preferences with the ENFP whatsoever. The ENFP can push our(INFJ) buttons quite easily since their orientation is faced away from each other. The ENFP will use their intuition outwards, while the INFJ would use it inwards and things as simple as what color the sky is would have different meanings for both of these types. In respect to the ESTP, yes, we are very different from each other, but instead of feeling repulsed by the way they see the world, it inspires us with their outlook in life. INFJ's weaknesses become the ESTP's strengths and vice versa. We may complement each other really well if you ask me.
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I am generally suspicious of ESTPs because they are very clever and are always trying to position themselves in any given social context. But the ESTP perspective fascinates me. It informs my own perspective. They promote themselves, but they work very hard to prove their worth. ESTPs are technical perfectionists and can work quite independently. They are confident of their own skills, but are open-minded enough to take good advice seriously when they get it. As a result, I (when I tested INFJ) successfully collaborated with normal ESTP adults. So I have to agree with you that the INFJ's shadow isn't the ESTP. INFJs and ESTPs can form very strategic and dynamic partnerships.

On the other hand, I have had to be very patient with most of the ENFPs I've met. Dealing with them is an exercise of virtue. It's not that I don't like them as individuals - I just can't understand how flighty they are, how unreliable, forgetful and moody, how they will postpone things indefinitely and give you no clue as to when things will resume. They seem to have no sense of time at all! And why must they always go around bragging and flirting when it's all based on lies?

In contrast, I *heart* INFPs. To me, they are the much improved version of their ENFP cousins. They remember and fulfill their commitments more often. They don't go around bragging the way some ENFPs do. They're a lot more shy, but I find that that makes them more careful and considerate. Sometimes I think that INFPs are the "fixed" version of ENFPs. *evil grin*

Well, that's me finding fault with my ENFP shadow. But now that I think about it, I believe I was in ENFP shadow mode just three years ago. And everytime I come up with a project, and second guess myself endlessly before commiting to it, I think that's my shadow archetype Ne slowing me down by throwing distractions in my path.

I guess ENFPs just need to be understood, loved, accepted, and then trained to focus, focus, focus.

*hugs ENFP*
 
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