Jesse Williams || USA

Asa

Asa

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“Let’s get a couple of things straight. The burden of the brutalized is not to comfort the bystander -- that’s not our job so let’s stop with all that. If you have a critique for our resistance then you’d better have an established record, a critique of our oppression.

“If you have no interest in equal rights for black people then do not make suggestions to those who do: sit down."


FULL SPEECH HERE:

[video]http://www.billboard.com/articles/news/7416612/jesse-williams-bet-awards-2016-speech-video[/video]
 
Thanks for this! I don't tend to tune in to award shows, so I knew nothing of this. Very powerful speech, eloquently delivered.
 
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Interesting perspective. Unfortunately a perspective subjugated to misinformation is a flawed perspective. And people will stand up to point that out and will not be not heard.
 
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My first experience on the site with someone I'm not likely to be friends with. I got this perspective after reading through said someone's list of topics. And then I discovered the "Ignore" button.
 
invisible said:
Ow ow! I think someone just got subducated...
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:grimacing: Wasn't my intent. But something about being told that my "interesting perspective" is "subducated to misinformation" and is therefore a "flawed perspective" seemed a bit haughty - and more than a little hypocritical, since said someone suffers the misinformation of not having the correct spelling of the word "subjugated." That being stated, said someone stood up to point that out and was indeed heard...and subsequently ignored, as seemed appropriate.

One of the last things I expected to encounter when I came to this site was bigotry and certainly not thinly veiled racism. Who knew?
 
SkipINFJ said:
:grimacing: Wasn't my intent. But something about being told that my "interesting perspective" is "subducated to misinformation" and is therefore a "flawed perspective" seemed a bit haughty - and more than a little hypocritical, since said someone suffers the misinformation of not having the correct spelling of the word "subjugated." That being stated, said someone stood up to point that out and was indeed heard...and subsequently ignored, as seemed appropriate.

One of the last things I expected to encounter when I came to this site was bigotry and certainly not thinly veiled racism. Who knew?
Click to expand...

Let me put it this way, it's very difficult for some people to fit in anywhere. Or did you think that no one would notice your unfamiliarity with the word "subducated"?
 
SkipINFJ said:
:grimacing: Wasn't my intent. But something about being told that my "interesting perspective" is "subducated to misinformation" and is therefore a "flawed perspective" seemed a bit haughty - and more than a little hypocritical, since said someone suffers the misinformation of not having the correct spelling of the word "subjugated." That being stated, said someone stood up to point that out and was indeed heard...and subsequently ignored, as seemed appropriate.

One of the last things I expected to encounter when I came to this site was bigotry and certainly not thinly veiled racism. Who knew?
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Im sorry but is the racism remark directed at anything I have said?
 
invisible said:
Let me put it this way, it's very difficult for some people to fit in anywhere. Or did you think that no one would notice your unfamiliarity with the word "subducated"?
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No, can't say I did. I was indeed unfamiliar with it, and I don't have a problem acknowledging that. As usual, when I come across an unfamiliar word or phrase, I look it up. Initially, I somehow overlooked a definition for "subducate" (I did come across "subducat and "subduce," however). When I looked for "subducated perspective," I got nothing. I did, however, find "subjugated perspective," which appeared to fit the context of this conversation.

I'm only familiar with the word now because you called me out. Thanks! I'm one word smarter!

As for the reminder that some people don't fit in anywhere: point made. Thanks for that too.
 
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Asa said:
“Let’s get a couple of things straight. The burden of the brutalized is not to comfort the bystander -- that’s not our job so let’s stop with all that. If you have a critique for our resistance then you’d better have an established record, a critique of our oppression.

“If you have no interest in equal rights for black people then do not make suggestions to those who do: sit down."


FULL SPEECH HERE:

[video]http://www.billboard.com/articles/news/7416612/jesse-williams-bet-awards-2016-speech-video[/video]
Click to expand...

@Asa thank you for posting that, a brilliant piece of oratory, I think the audience reaction speaks volumes.

@SkipINFJ @invisible - can I very gently say that whilst I usually find @Eventhorizon opinions and views at odds with my own, I have never seen anything that he has posted that I would describe as racist. I think what he has at times said, is that to overuse or focus on 'race' as an issue, has the potential to devalue genuine claims of racism when they arise. I hope I am not not misrepresenting his view, in saying that, I am sure he will correct me if he disagrees.

I think here, he might have phrased his objection differently, and given more of his rationale for having a different viewpoint.

Personally from what I can see, the problems black people face in America (and other countries) once examined objectively, cannot be denied. Their mistreatment in employment, in the justice system, in almost every facet of society is obvious and indefensible. It is no surprise to me that they are seeking to organize and oppose it. I wish them every success.

Whilst I may hold very different views to @Eventhorizon I am glad that this forum is diverse and encompasses different ideas and opinions. I prefer that my own views are tested critically and scrutinized by others who may see things very differently, even if it sometimes makes me uncomfortable. So i haven't hit the 'ignore' button on anyone here so far.

I hope this post doesn't antagonize anyone, that is not my intention.
 
Eventhorizon said:
Interesting perspective. Unfortunately a perspective subjugated to misinformation is a flawed perspective. And people will stand up to point that out and will not be not heard.
Click to expand...

Thank you, by the way, for yet another
SkipINFJ said:
No, can't say I did. I was indeed unfamiliar with it, and I don't have a problem acknowledging that. As usual, when I come across an unfamiliar word or phrase, I look it up. Initially, I somehow overlooked a definition for "subducate" (I did come across "subducat and "subduce," however). When I looked for "subducated perspective," I got nothing. I did, however, find "subjugated perspective," which appeared to fit the context of this conversation.

I'm only familiar with the word now because you called me out. Thanks! I'm one word smarter!

As for the reminder that some people don't fit in anywhere: point made. Thanks for that too.
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I'm just kidding around with you. I'm pretty sure he meant subjugated.

Eventhorizon has a real habit of expressing disagreement at opportune moments with absolutely no content, such as in this instance of his offering of totally vacuous rhetorical criticism, permeated with disgust and dismissal but offering no discernible sophisticated argument whatsoever. I have sometimes tried to engage him meaningfully on things he's said but he's very inflexible in his ideas and doesn't even care if he contradicts himself.

I really have no idea why he persists in hanging around this forum, as he seems to have expressed numerous times that he doesn't like the forum, and that he seems to scorn F types and anything that they say in general. But I'm glad he um, stays here if he wants to? I dunno. Like you, I use the ignore button, because regularly, the stuff he comes out with makes me sick.

Anyway, welcome to INFJs.
 
invisible said:
Thank you, by the way, for yet another


I'm just kidding around with you. I'm pretty sure he meant subjugated.

Eventhorizon has a real habit of expressing disagreement at opportune moments with absolutely no content, such as in this instance of his offering of totally vacuous rhetorical criticism, permeated with disgust and dismissal but offering no discernible sophisticated argument whatsoever. I have sometimes tried to engage him meaningfully on things he's said but he's very inflexible in his ideas and doesn't even care if he contradicts himself.

I really have no idea why he persists in hanging around this forum, as he seems to have expressed numerous times that he doesn't like the forum, and that he seems to scorn F types and anything that they say in general. But I'm glad he um, stays here if he wants to? I dunno. Like you, I use the ignore button, because regularly, the stuff he comes out with makes me sick.

Anyway, welcome to INFJs.
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I think thats the nicest thing you have ever said about me.
When havd I ever contradicted myself and when have you ever tried to engage me in discussion where I have not tried the same? Just because you say something and I continue to disagree does not mean there was no discussion.

I ve said I hang around this forum for different perspectives. The part I dont like is that many here dont offer any reasonable argument other than they simply feel one way or the other about something. Never taking the facts of life into account. Never taking the facts of thr hostile universe we live in into account. I just "feel" something is wrong or right. And yeah, I have a hard time with that.
Even so you and others have helped me tremendously. So thank you for that.
 
invisible said:
Thank you, by the way, for yet another


I'm just kidding around with you. I'm pretty sure he meant subjugated.

Eventhorizon has a real habit of expressing disagreement at opportune moments with absolutely no content, such as in this instance of his offering of totally vacuous rhetorical criticism, permeated with disgust and dismissal but offering no discernible sophisticated argument whatsoever. I have sometimes tried to engage him meaningfully on things he's said but he's very inflexible in his ideas and doesn't even care if he contradicts himself.

I really have no idea why he persists in hanging around this forum, as he seems to have expressed numerous times that he doesn't like the forum, and that he seems to scorn F types and anything that they say in general. But I'm glad he um, stays here if he wants to? I dunno. Like you, I use the ignore button, because regularly, the stuff he comes out with makes me sick.

Anyway, welcome to INFJs.
Click to expand...
No, thank you. I've been re-awakened to quite a bit in a short time and found some new awarenesses and wiser ways to express and share. Adios.
 
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