Domnant-Tertiary loops in ISTPs and INFJs

[Thinkist]

I have been wondering if there's any difference between a Ti-Ni loop in an ISTP, and an Ni-Ti loop in an INFJ, if any. I haven't come up with anything on this yet...

 

[Psyche]

Difference -- basically the order of function? The loop doesn't dictate a change in dominant function, but rather bypassing the auxiliary function., imo.

Personally, I don't buy such dom-tert loop.

 

[Kmal]

ISTP/INFJ: Ti/Ni or Ni/Ti--Schizoid Personality Disorder. These types are socially incompetent for lack of trying, because they see little to no value in significant interaction with others. They live in their own abstract worlds, constantly second-guessing themselves as Ti poses a framework for a problem and Ni shoots it down as too definitionally precise. Without any real external input, these two functions will dream up all sorts of elaborate systems and implications for them, only to repeat their own self-defeating behavior, never bothering to emphasize putting any of its intense ideas into practice. Frequent disregard for rules,laws and other forms of behavioral standards is common, as no function provides any significant sense of external influence. If Se/Fe were doing its job, the user would recognize the value of connecting with others and of paying attention to their needs, preferences, habits and appearances.

This what you were looking for? Should be the same according to the theory.

Personally, I don't buy such dom-tert loop.

In the theory, or in life? Certainly exists in abstract, but surely unhealthiness doesnt exist on earth!

 

[Thinkist]

Maybe my question was motivated by this article, particularly these sections:

For ISTPs:

Tertiary Ni: "I can't possibly go along with this, 'cuz it's all a lie. It's all a set-up by the Man. I'd just be serving his interests and not my own. I'm not gonna be suckered by all this self-serving bull. No way, man, I gotta go my own way." The Secondary Function would say: "This thing's bigger than you. Better just go with the flow, do what you can, trust your instincts to deal with what's right here and now."

For INFJs:

Tertiary Ti: "I can't possibly go along with this, because it makes no sense. It's filled with internal contradictions. It's crude and not true to the real principles of how this works. It's trying to shove an inappropriately a priori conceptual structure onto the reality. I will have to go by feel, and where it leads I can't know until I get there. I've got to trust this groove regardless of people's arbitrary expectations." The Secondary Function would say: "You've reached the limits of what you can do alone. You can make others feel important by telling them your needs and asking for their help, and yielding some genuine control to them. See who you can find common cause with."

Maybe it is just function order, but maybe it's also the way it manifests. There may be no difference bewtween a Ti-Ni loop and an Ni-Ti loop, but maybe a difference in the way it starts.

 

[InvisibleJim]

Lenores dominant tertiary loop theory seems bunk because she considers that the loop is always negative/dissociative where clearly the loop if at all merely indicates a momentary a focus, and more importantly to both the tertiary and inferior.

 

[Psyche]

In the theory, or in life? Certainly exists in abstract, but surely unhealthiness doesnt exist on earth!

LOL. In theory, this dom-tert loop can be "possible" in a Jungian function development context but I won't associate them to ISTP/INFJ as such labels are of MBTI's and MBTI adheres to a hierarchical function development.

In life? I have no shame in claiming my Fe is equally developed with that of my Ti.

 

[Auto-Zen]

I think the dom/tert loop idea is on to something but it falls short.

I think that the 1st/3rd loop is actually present in the normal operation of a person, as is the 2nd/4th. That would mean you use introversion as a set or loop of functions and you use extroversion as a set of functions.

If you are unbalanced, an introvert that has very little interaction or an extravert that puts no time aside to plan and think, then that means you aren't using your 2nd/4th loop enough. Your just using your 1st/3rd main set all the time, it's supposed to be used MOST but not exclusively.
If you had no chance to use your main you'd be dramatically distressed. Not using your 2nd is easier and just creates a poisoned 'out of shape' state that can last a lifetime. This is the dom/tert loop idea but the loop idea proposes that missing your 2nd CREATES the loop.

http://www.infjs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21916

Heres the thread with my idea, it's still a bit rough I think. I need to write more on some things, condense others into more easily readable chunks and get some other stuff straight enough to put into words.

 

[Kmal]

Maybe it is just function order, but maybe it's also the way it manifests. There may be no difference bewtween a Ti-Ni loop and an Ni-Ti loop, but maybe a difference in the way it starts.

I see what you're saying- if a circle starts at the top, it's still a circle; if it starts on the side, right, left, or bottom, it's still a circle.

 

[Trifoilum]

Mastery, generally expected proficiency;

the way 60 A + 40 B is different than 40 A + 60 B.

In reality, it's translated to so much more. How you deal with each and particular conflicts and how you take each and every one of its part, how you learn from experience and how you see challenges, etc, etc, etc, etc.