I view that as unkind. What befalls a man can render him without all his facilities. That does not give one the authority to judge him as such. That is low.
The future is uncertain and the end is always near...
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I view that as unkind. What befalls a man can render him without all his facilities. That does not give one the authority to judge him as such. That is low.
If I am judged for what I believe, what does it matter to anyone else that believes I'm insane? Thoughts are not enough to just place an answer here. One must put in the time, run the many miles, and prepare themselves. I seriously doubt many have put in the hours to justify their thoughts. They have freedom of speech and thinking, but are they an authority? Is there an authority? The moment someone believes a certain way, are they open to discern what will happen? Surely, we humor ourselves to talk down someone's belief in a religion. Most have not studied their religion enough to even know what to expect. Most cannot explain Trinity, so they go into denial of all religions and beliefs.
What if someone came and fulfilled scriptures? I guess that means little to most. It means a lot to me. By His stripes we are healed......written in Isaiah many years before it happened.
What if someone came and fulfilled scriptures? I guess that means little to most. It means a lot to me. By His stripes we are healed......written in Isaiah many years before it happened.
Please elaborate. And use my first post as a guide. You seem to believe in prophecy. What do you believe is foretold and why?
thank you! <3
its not a bed of roses all the time, but in general im very happy to be the way i am
the end of the world and the apocalypse. hmm. its scary. its probably healthy to consider such existential matters. ive spent a lot of time thinking about the state of the world, and when and how it would end. one day i just decided to stop. its all out of our hands. all we can do is try to influence the world in a positive way while were here. thats what i think, anyway
to quote prince's 1999:
'everybodys got a bomb, we could all die any day / but before ill let that happen, ill dance my life away'
I believe that we see into the future far more often, or rather intuitively know certain outcomes (if you listen carefully and quietly), and have it subconsciously or consciously (if you are in tune to that) become the deciding factor in certain areas or events that take place in our lives.
For instance...there is the theory of the paranormal that certain “ghosts” are not “ghosts” at all in the sense that they are the spirit of a deceased person.
This is the stone-tape theory that highly emotionally charged events such as a murder are somehow recorded in the stone or wood or surrounding home...it creates and then occasionally “plays back” the incident...what causes them to replay is a mystery...but such “hauntings” as they are called seem to be unaware of the person seeing the apparition and repeats the incident again and again.
There are many possible reasons if you believe in such things (which you know I do, because I have seen them and I’m not a schizophrenic).
One thought of mine is once the person has no longer ceased to “live” in this earthy body that the spirit also transcends time/space, and what you are seeing is a divot or a bump that under that right conditions allows multiple people to see the same event play out at multiple times throughout the timeline itself which ceases to exist in the way we sense it now.
The global consciousness project has placed RNGs (random number generators) around the globe...because for a long time, scientists studying how our mind can effect such devices has shown to have a small but measurable result.
Anyhow...my point was, the data collect on 9/11 was highly impressive.
So whenever the RNGs start to sync up, or the numbers on them all begin to correlate, it produces a graph and gives you odds of it being just a fluke.
What is particularly interesting about the data that day was the RNGs began to correlate several hours before the incident took place, peaked during and right after the incident and then tapered off in the following 3 days.
The statisticians and others who have subsequently crunched the numbers put the odds in the trillion to 1 category.
I can provide links of course if you like, just ask...I don’t want to flood your thread with graphs and shit.
Also, they have conducted research using fMRI imaging, and the subjects were shown either a calm picture like a flower or a graphic picture of something violent....the computer chooses at random the next picture and also chose at random when it would switch to the next picture.
They were able to show that the human brain reacted subconsciously an average of 5-10 seconds before the violent picture was shown...this study with the same results has been duplicated several times now by other research teams.
So I don’t find prophecy to be too far fetched...especially if someone practices to try and hone such abilities.
I’ll have to get to the rest in another post haha.
For instance...there is the theory of the paranormal that certain “ghosts” are not “ghosts” at all in the sense that they are the spirit of a deceased person.
This is the stone-tape theory that highly emotionally charged events such as a murder are somehow recorded in the stone or wood or surrounding home...it creates and then occasionally “plays back” the incident...what causes them to replay is a mystery...but such “hauntings” as they are called seem to be unaware of the person seeing the apparition and repeats the incident again and again.
There are many possible reasons if you believe in such things (which you know I do, because I have seen them and I’m not a schizophrenic).
One thought of mine is once the person has no longer ceased to “live” in this earthy body that the spirit also transcends time/space, and what you are seeing is a divot or a bump that under that right conditions allows multiple people to see the same event play out at multiple times throughout the timeline itself which ceases to exist in the way we sense it now.
The global consciousness project has placed RNGs (random number generators) around the globe...because for a long time, scientists studying how our mind can effect such devices has shown to have a small but measurable result.
Anyhow...my point was, the data collect on 9/11 was highly impressive.
So whenever the RNGs start to sync up, or the numbers on them all begin to correlate, it produces a graph and gives you odds of it being just a fluke.
What is particularly interesting about the data that day was the RNGs began to correlate several hours before the incident took place, peaked during and right after the incident and then tapered off in the following 3 days.
The statisticians and others who have subsequently crunched the numbers put the odds in the trillion to 1 category.
I can provide links of course if you like, just ask...I don’t want to flood your thread with graphs and shit.
Also, they have conducted research using fMRI imaging, and the subjects were shown either a calm picture like a flower or a graphic picture of something violent....the computer chooses at random the next picture and also chose at random when it would switch to the next picture.
They were able to show that the human brain reacted subconsciously an average of 5-10 seconds before the violent picture was shown...this study with the same results has been duplicated several times now by other research teams.
So I don’t find prophecy to be too far fetched...especially if someone practices to try and hone such abilities.
I’ll have to get to the rest in another post haha.
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Some people believe that we see in our dreams exactly what will take place the next day or so, giving us some kind of spiritual/mental preparation for specific incidents.
Then...most people forget what took place in their dreams and don’t realize they’ve done it once already in last night’s dream...though occasionally someone will remember if it is something that will possibly be traumatic in some way or others have suggested this explains the feeling or sense of deja vu.
Just food for thought.
Then...most people forget what took place in their dreams and don’t realize they’ve done it once already in last night’s dream...though occasionally someone will remember if it is something that will possibly be traumatic in some way or others have suggested this explains the feeling or sense of deja vu.
Just food for thought.
A couple of great posts. Very informative. If time is an illusion, and our lives are like watching a movie which exists on a dvd or something, why couldn't we essentially fast forward to another scene into the future? You contribute some interesting takes on ghosts and deja vu as well. I find it interesting that Apollo is the Greek god associated with prophecy. To me that indicates that prophecy is in part connected with being like Apollo, as in rational, objective, emotionally detached, having perspective, and adopting a long term approach. There may certainly be both logical and mystical elements to prophecy. So what exactly would distinguish a true prophet (if you believe they exist) from everyone else? Practice? Currently I am exploring human potential. I tend to believe psychic abilities or instincts like intuition and even prophecy do exist. I also think telepathy is possible. As for telekinesis, I am open minded yet skeptical. What is your take on psychic abilities, telepathy, and telekinesis, and how they may relate to the collective unconscious, prophecy, catastrophism, salvationism, a golden age, the apocalypse, miracles, and human history/origins? And more importantly, could I learn to fly like super man, Neo, or the teens in Chronicle without the use of technology? Please reply in ten words or less. Just kidding. Chew on this one bro. Bonus points for mentioning shrooms which I believe can increase telepathic abilities. Yet they are illegal. Coincidence?
- Dec 29, 2009
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[MENTION=14664]dang[/MENTION] - I think you are a bit of a rogue, which I kinda like. Also I think like a typical INFJ you have a great deal of depth to your character.
I have thought about a lot of these things. I think I strive for a rational explanation of things, but I have gradually come to a view that the 'world' might not be a rational place. Once you begin a study of mathematics and science some fairly mind-boggling things begin to emerge, that often make religious views seem more credible. For me, I think it is about expanding our minds and connecting with each other. I don't think we can come to these answers alone.
I'm going to share one thing that happened to me, that I tried to ignore for many years. A few days after my father died ( I was 17) I went with my mother to see his remains laid out. For me it was a empty shell, they made his deceased remains look presentable but having touched him (he was of course stone cold) I knew at once what was in front of me was not my father. A few days later I went to visit a friend, and I only walked down the road a short way when I saw an older man walking like they were trying to stay inconspicuous. He glanced up and I recognized my fathers face. It happened very fast, he immediately looked down and walked away.
For a few seconds I was shocked. Then I walked after him very quickly (I still don't understand why I didn't just run). Even though I walked as fast as I could, I was practically jogging, I could not catch up to him. After a few minutes I finally did sort of get ahead and when I looked around it was a totally different man. I read up on it afterwards, and it's quite a well known psychological thing, and that's what the rational part of my mind wants to accept.
The problem for me though is, the experience felt so real, even down to the way the man walked and looked up, the body language was completely that of my father. I'm quite sure if there is an 'afterlife' we are not meant to come back and see people, but it would have been absolutely typical of my father to ignore the rules and do his own thing. He always did his whole life, not in a wild way, just true to himself. Have you ever played chess with an INTJ ? They are very very good, but I've found they tend to stick to a rational plan, I'm not sure they believe it when they play an INFJ who can read them (probably much better than the board) and beat them. It almost feels like cheating, but they seem to be bound by the rational strategy and limited by it.
I don't think I've managed to explain a single thing I meant to say, but for me life often feels like a long bout of Deja Vu. A weird almost surreal feeling that I'm watching a repeat.
I have thought about a lot of these things. I think I strive for a rational explanation of things, but I have gradually come to a view that the 'world' might not be a rational place. Once you begin a study of mathematics and science some fairly mind-boggling things begin to emerge, that often make religious views seem more credible. For me, I think it is about expanding our minds and connecting with each other. I don't think we can come to these answers alone.
I'm going to share one thing that happened to me, that I tried to ignore for many years. A few days after my father died ( I was 17) I went with my mother to see his remains laid out. For me it was a empty shell, they made his deceased remains look presentable but having touched him (he was of course stone cold) I knew at once what was in front of me was not my father. A few days later I went to visit a friend, and I only walked down the road a short way when I saw an older man walking like they were trying to stay inconspicuous. He glanced up and I recognized my fathers face. It happened very fast, he immediately looked down and walked away.
For a few seconds I was shocked. Then I walked after him very quickly (I still don't understand why I didn't just run). Even though I walked as fast as I could, I was practically jogging, I could not catch up to him. After a few minutes I finally did sort of get ahead and when I looked around it was a totally different man. I read up on it afterwards, and it's quite a well known psychological thing, and that's what the rational part of my mind wants to accept.
The problem for me though is, the experience felt so real, even down to the way the man walked and looked up, the body language was completely that of my father. I'm quite sure if there is an 'afterlife' we are not meant to come back and see people, but it would have been absolutely typical of my father to ignore the rules and do his own thing. He always did his whole life, not in a wild way, just true to himself. Have you ever played chess with an INTJ ? They are very very good, but I've found they tend to stick to a rational plan, I'm not sure they believe it when they play an INFJ who can read them (probably much better than the board) and beat them. It almost feels like cheating, but they seem to be bound by the rational strategy and limited by it.
I don't think I've managed to explain a single thing I meant to say, but for me life often feels like a long bout of Deja Vu. A weird almost surreal feeling that I'm watching a repeat.
I know someone who claims that every time we have a conversation, he remembers already having had the same conversation. Like Nietzsche said, "Once is forever." Perhaps prophecy has nothing to do with prediction, but rather understanding and remembering. How many times have I already typed this post? Was it inevitable I would be typing it again? Mind fuck alert.
- Dec 29, 2009
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I think I get it, I would say noting like that has ever happened to me since, but I'm kind of 60/40 on the F-T measure maybe even closer to the middle. I do think that perhaps some of the full 'F' measure INFJ's really do experience something akin to a psychic experience. I also think it's suspected in the scientific community, but that it's pretty much career suicide to admit it, and as it doesn't easily lend itself to reductive, measurable scientific study no one will discuss it in a serious manner.
- Dec 29, 2009
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- 22,536
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- MBTI
- INFJ
No I think it's just a reputation thing - the credibility of science rests on what it can explain and prove. It is very fearful of what it can't. Ultimately if we knew 'everything' would we get old, or sick, or have accidents and die? It maybe reassuring to think science has all the answers. I think the reality is it is a mixed blessing, and we have far more questions than answers.
Should we not show caution what we ask for? Can we truly bear things others do not dare even talk about? How few there be would ask God for such a thing as Solomon asked for. I feel true understanding will come to a clean heart looking to use his understanding to help others. That has been surely shown in the past. As for the present? How many, seeing a day in advance, would not run to the lottery? What we ask for is so important. To prophesy is a great thing, for it is speaking the words of God. Does a man ask to do this? I feel though many are called, few are chosen for such things. [FONT=&]But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.
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I would like to edit to state I may or may not believe what I copied and pasted in its entirety.
[/FONT]
- Rabbinic scholar Maimonides, suggested that "prophecy is, in truth and reality, an emanation sent forth by Divine Being through the medium of the Active Intellect, in the first instance to man's rational faculty, and then to hisimaginative faculty." Judaism[edit]
See also: Prophets in Judaism and Nevi'im
David and Saul, detail from a 1878 oil painting, Nationalmuseum, Stockholm
The Hebrew term for prophet Navi literally means "spokesperson", he speaks to the people as a mouthpiece of God, and to God on behalf of the people. "The name prophet, from the Greek meaning "forespeaker" (πρὸ being used in the original local sense), is an equivalent of the Hebrew נבוא , which signifies properly a delegate or mouthpiece of another." A major theme of the Nevi'im is social justice.[SUP][23][/SUP]
According to Judaism, authentic Nevuah (Heb.: נבואה, "Prophecy") got withdrawn from the world after the destruction of the first Jerusalem Temple.[SUP][23][/SUP] Malachi is acknowledged to have been the last authentic prophet if one accepts the opinion that Nechemyah died in Babylon before 9th Tevet 3448 (313 BCE).[SUP][24][/SUP]
The Torah contains laws concerning the false prophet (Deuteronomy 13:2-6, 18:20-22). Prophets in Christianity like Daniel, or prophets in Islam like Jesus, Loth, and Muhammad, for example, are not prophets or false prophets according to Jewish standards.[SUP][11][/SUP]
In the Torah, prophecy often consisted of a conditioned warning by God of the consequences should the society, specific communities, or their leaders not adhere to Torah's instructions in the time contemporary with the prophet's life. Prophecies sometimes included conditioned promises of blessing for obeying God, and returning to behaviors and laws as written in the Torah. Conditioned warning prophecies feature in all Jewish works of theTanakh.
Notably Maimunides (Rambam), philosophically suggested there once were many levels of prophecy, from the highest such as those experienced by Moses, to the lowest where the individuals were able to apprehend the Divine Will, but not respond or even describe this experience to others, citing in example, Shem, Eber and most notably, Noah, who, in biblical narrative, does not issue prophetic declarations.[SUP][25][/SUP]
Maimonides, in his philosophical work The Guide for the Perplexed, outlines twelve modes of prophecy[SUP][26][/SUP] from lesser to greater degree of clarity:
The Tanakh contains prophecies from various Hebrew prophets (55 in total) who communicated messages from God to the nation of Israel, and later the population of Judea and elsewhere. Experience of prophecy in the Torah and the rest of Tanakh was not restricted to Jews. Nor was the prophetic experience restricted to the Hebrew language.- Inspired actions
- Inspired words
- Allegorical dream revelations
- Auditory dream revelations
- Audiovisual dream revelations/human speaker
- Audiovisual dream revelations/angelic speaker
- Audiovisual dream revelations/Divine speaker
- Allegorical waking vision
- Auditory waking revelation
- Audiovisual waking revelation/human speaker
- Audiovisual waking revelation/angelic speaker
- Audiovisual waking revelation/Divine speaker (that refers implicitly to Moses)
I would like to edit to state I may or may not believe what I copied and pasted in its entirety.
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Should we not show caution what we ask for? Can we truly bear things others do not dare even talk about? How few there be would ask God for such a thing as Solomon asked for. I feel true understanding will come to a clean heart looking to use his understanding to help others. That has been surely shown in the past. As for the present? How many, seeing a day in advance, would not run to the lottery? What we ask for is so important. To prophesy is a great thing, for it is speaking the words of God. Does a man ask to do this? I feel though many are called, few are chosen for such things. [FONT=&]But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.
[/FONT]
- Rabbinic scholar Maimonides, suggested that "prophecy is, in truth and reality, an emanation sent forth by Divine Being through the medium of the Active Intellect, in the first instance to man's rational faculty, and then to hisimaginative faculty." Judaism[edit]
See also: Prophets in Judaism and Nevi'im
David and Saul, detail from a 1878 oil painting, Nationalmuseum, Stockholm
The Hebrew term for prophet Navi literally means "spokesperson", he speaks to the people as a mouthpiece of God, and to God on behalf of the people. "The name prophet, from the Greek meaning "forespeaker" (πρὸ being used in the original local sense), is an equivalent of the Hebrew נבוא , which signifies properly a delegate or mouthpiece of another." A major theme of the Nevi'im is social justice.[SUP][23][/SUP]
According to Judaism, authentic Nevuah (Heb.: נבואה, "Prophecy") got withdrawn from the world after the destruction of the first Jerusalem Temple.[SUP][23][/SUP] Malachi is acknowledged to have been the last authentic prophet if one accepts the opinion that Nechemyah died in Babylon before 9th Tevet 3448 (313 BCE).[SUP][24][/SUP]
The Torah contains laws concerning the false prophet (Deuteronomy 13:2-6, 18:20-22). Prophets in Christianity like Daniel, or prophets in Islam like Jesus, Loth, and Muhammad, for example, are not prophets or false prophets according to Jewish standards.[SUP][11][/SUP]
In the Torah, prophecy often consisted of a conditioned warning by God of the consequences should the society, specific communities, or their leaders not adhere to Torah's instructions in the time contemporary with the prophet's life. Prophecies sometimes included conditioned promises of blessing for obeying God, and returning to behaviors and laws as written in the Torah. Conditioned warning prophecies feature in all Jewish works of theTanakh.
Notably Maimunides (Rambam), philosophically suggested there once were many levels of prophecy, from the highest such as those experienced by Moses, to the lowest where the individuals were able to apprehend the Divine Will, but not respond or even describe this experience to others, citing in example, Shem, Eber and most notably, Noah, who, in biblical narrative, does not issue prophetic declarations.[SUP][25][/SUP]
Maimonides, in his philosophical work The Guide for the Perplexed, outlines twelve modes of prophecy[SUP][26][/SUP] from lesser to greater degree of clarity:
The Tanakh contains prophecies from various Hebrew prophets (55 in total) who communicated messages from God to the nation of Israel, and later the population of Judea and elsewhere. Experience of prophecy in the Torah and the rest of Tanakh was not restricted to Jews. Nor was the prophetic experience restricted to the Hebrew language.
- Inspired actions
- Inspired words
- Allegorical dream revelations
- Auditory dream revelations
- Audiovisual dream revelations/human speaker
- Audiovisual dream revelations/angelic speaker
- Audiovisual dream revelations/Divine speaker
- Allegorical waking vision
- Auditory waking revelation
- Audiovisual waking revelation/human speaker
- Audiovisual waking revelation/angelic speaker
- Audiovisual waking revelation/Divine speaker (that refers implicitly to Moses)
I would like to edit to state I may or may not believe what I copied and pasted in its entirety.
I agree wholeheartedly with your posting, and (non-sarcastically) thank you for the time it must have taken to compile.
Do you believe it’s possible for those who’s heart is pure, who is truly a good person at their core could ever see visions shown to him/her by God...even if that person believes that God isn’t necessarily a personage but is “everything” like the Buddhists believe?
Could such a person also be a mouthpiece for “God” even though they may be a Jew or a Christian or a Atheist?
Is there a correlation? Or have the churches suppressed such people they have deemed “unworthy” or for political reasons “i.e. Joan of Arc”?
Honestly curious what your views are on those questions if you would be so kind.
It actually took hours to find the right words to state the full definitive measures of prophecy, so I thank you and know you understood.
I have not studied prophetic words of those other religions. A donkey spoke once, so who am I to judge such things? Was this donkey a Christian or Jew, I ask of you?
I believe there will come a day of reckoning when one will speak for those that cannot speak for themselves.
The Jews would not proclaim Muhammad a Prophet of God, though he asked it of them. They told him he was not of their God, so they could not proclaim him a prophet of their God. Makes sense to me. I could not proclaim a person speaking nominally for Buddha as a prophet of God. However, I do not know Buddha. Wouldn't they claim to be a mouthpiece for Buddha? I think so.
I have reason to believe the "church", as you call it(not as I call it), has tried to suppress things and people for making waves with the way things are. I also believe some people suppress themselves when they are avoided or made lite(sp) of. I also believe some things are shown to or spoken to a person that might be a message just for them. I believe there are people more susceptible to God's Word or vision than most. Look at Galileo: smart, observant, and crashed with "the church".
Look at Martin Luther and the Reformation. Bumpy roads and even wars. Try to get the church out of it now. The church, as I know it as being the people, should be in the Preparation: preparing the way for God's coming. The scriptures hint of it. He that hath ears, let him hear.
I have not studied prophetic words of those other religions. A donkey spoke once, so who am I to judge such things? Was this donkey a Christian or Jew, I ask of you?
I believe there will come a day of reckoning when one will speak for those that cannot speak for themselves.
The Jews would not proclaim Muhammad a Prophet of God, though he asked it of them. They told him he was not of their God, so they could not proclaim him a prophet of their God. Makes sense to me. I could not proclaim a person speaking nominally for Buddha as a prophet of God. However, I do not know Buddha. Wouldn't they claim to be a mouthpiece for Buddha? I think so.
I have reason to believe the "church", as you call it(not as I call it), has tried to suppress things and people for making waves with the way things are. I also believe some people suppress themselves when they are avoided or made lite(sp) of. I also believe some things are shown to or spoken to a person that might be a message just for them. I believe there are people more susceptible to God's Word or vision than most. Look at Galileo: smart, observant, and crashed with "the church".
Look at Martin Luther and the Reformation. Bumpy roads and even wars. Try to get the church out of it now. The church, as I know it as being the people, should be in the Preparation: preparing the way for God's coming. The scriptures hint of it. He that hath ears, let him hear.