The Beauty of Spouses Embracing Individuality | INFJ Forum

The Beauty of Spouses Embracing Individuality

serenesam

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Jul 17, 2011
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I remember as a teenager looking for an apartment with my mother and we stumbled across this one apartment that was slightly a bit more expensive although ultimately we never really rented it and decided to rent somewhere else cheaper. We did get to meet up with the landlord to see the inside of it and the landlord was very talkative telling us about the neighbors next door. He mentioned about a husband and a wife living separately in two apartments and found it to be odd. At that time, I did find it unusual and strange too and so did my mother. Now at the age of twenty-six, while I may not fully understand the situation, I believe I may have understood somewhat of the situation given the fact that I am an American-born citizen. It is no secret that Asians tend to place a heavy emphasis on collectivism and so I don’t think I have to go into detail elaborating that very notion. For the first time in my life not back when I was a teenager but right now in the present moment as I am thinking of this past event along with many other things in my mind, I finally understood or at least partially understood the beauty of individualism, non-dependency, and individual achievement. I find it an interesting and awesome experience being married to a woman and having to wake up everyday not having to see the same face every single day and going about my daily business making a living for myself and seeing her only on occasion. Contrary to the notion by some perhaps the more emotional sensitive or even spiritual type of people who claim that you usually know if your spouse is the one for you when he or she wakes up every morning and has bad hygiene, I believe this point to be nonsense.

The fact that a husband and a wife can happily live separately tells me three things: 1). That the internal love between a man and a woman is an illusion perhaps propagated by television thereby influencing our peers and eventually us or particular individuals because ultimately people can have affection towards multiple individuals and in some cases, the more broad affection towards people and other organisms both organic and inorganic. 2). That the physical appearance of either the male (must be shaven, have a nice haircut, teeth should be white and not yellow, and other hygiene) or the female (might want to put on make-up though obviously there are exceptions to every rule because some women actually look better without make-up, put on lipstick and preferably prefer the color red, be thoroughly shaved wherever there is hair through the body with the exception of the hair of course because some women look extraordinary beautiful with long hair) is something to not be dismissed, undervalued, overlooked, or underestimated. 3). That the dichotomy of separation and non-separation or togetherness is an issue of relevant discussion no different than some libertarians saying that we can be distinct and unified at the same time and in the case of the husband and wife, the distinction, glorification of uniqueness, and individuality would or should allow one spouse or the other to pursue the freedom of desired goals and/or dreams. In order to fully achieve the desired goals with a maximum sense of individual achievement done by one own and knowing that one fully earned it on one own, non-dependency on spouses, family, and friends is crucial for the very purpose of setting very high standards or increasing the bar. By allowing spouses or associates to “help” in achieving goals, standards may be lowered, bars may not be set as high to the maximum possible, and one cannot proclaim complete earning of a goal or objective as there is a difference between the word earn and receive or get.

I am fully aware that proponents of collectivism may argue that the psychological state of the human being is more likely on average to be much more healthier and yes there certainly is evidence to support this notion. I do not disagree with this as there are certainly cultures that place a heavy emphasis on collectivism such as Asians but seeing the flaws and weaknesses within Asian human beings themselves is indicative and reflective with regard to the problems with collectivism. Examples may include the passive nature of Asians, intense dislike pertaining to unfamiliar or ambiguous territory and/or situations in contrast to the daring experimental attitude of individualism and adventure, and falling behind or slow to respond or concoct innovative technology such as America making the nuclear bomb before China only further proof of the ingenuity of individualistic American that was perhaps at one time truly the greatest country on Earth. Collectivism ridicules individuals who want to think outside the box, go beyond what is required by the group mind, or come up with something that others may find antagonistic or disruptive to the group order. It may claim to embrace freedom and freewill but this is illusory because there is heavy value for the group over the individual thereby limiting freedom. The key emphasis is a balance between both individualistic and collectivistic oriented type (or that which is similar to both) for a thriving society both in the context of human relationships and the more broad sense of world order.
 
what an interesting post... i had a difficult time processing your points and understanding your position... so i have some questions...

I find it an interesting and awesome experience being married to a woman and having to wake up everyday not having to see the same face every single day and going about my daily business making a living for myself and seeing her only on occasion.

to clarify, are you in this type of relationship? do you and your wife both live in separate apartments? how often is on occasion?

ultimately people can have affection towards multiple individuals

so are you accepting of open relationships in marriage?

That the physical appearance of either the male or female... is something to not be dismissed, undervalued, overlooked, or underestimated.

while this is true, there is a fine line between this^^^ and being a superficial a-hole... if my SO couldn’t deal with how i looked in the morning, i would think that he had a severe mental problem...

By allowing spouses or associates to “help” in achieving goals, standards may be lowered, bars may not be set as high to the maximum possible, and one cannot proclaim complete earning of a goal or objective as there is a difference between the word earn and receive or get.

i have a difficult time processing this statement... imo one of the points of being in a relationship is being able to help your SO achieve their goals... who’s standards are you comparing against? why is it important how the goal is achieved if it ultimately is? if someone isn’t able to see the growth and value in that i would think that they wouldn’t be ready for an adult relationship.

The fact that a husband and a wife can live [happily] separately tells me....

there is a gross assumption that both people in the relationship are ‘happy’ to be in that relationship and that the relationship’s foundation rests on convenience. why even bother getting married aside from the tax breaks?
 
Are you basing this entire thing off of one anecdote about a situation that you don't have much inside information about?

I think this is all pretty interesting, but you are touching on a lot of different points here and it's confusing.
 
Keeping separate bedrooms is common enough for spouses - especially historically. In our current day I know a few spouses who sleep in different rooms because of snoring, shift work, etc.

Also, spouses often have a sitting room for her; and a den for him.

I take the two apartments couple as one of those situations, but with people who just got two apartments, instead of one big one with lots of rooms.


What you're going on about is "open ended" relationships (ie. the swinger's lifestyle).
 
i totally understand the concept of living apart and still having a marriage/relationship. as long as children aren't involved it's actually the best way in my opinion. i'm a very private person, and i also need a lot of alone time.
right now i'm in a relationship that is at the stage i absolutely adore. we are still cute, we still flirt with each other, and we still can't wait to see one another. it's the magic stage and i never want to be out of it. i believe (at least for myself) that once i share a home with someone that all goes out the window. that and the fact that i prefer to sleep alone will keep me from ever living with a partner again.
 
I agree with niffer, the original post touches on several topics that may or may not be related to living with a spouse or partner and this makes it confusing. To address just the topic of couples living together vs. separate residences, personally, I prefer living together for a lot of reasons, but that is just my preference.

I feel that however people want to design any given relationship is basically up to the people involved in that relationship. As long as the parties involved agree with the relationship design. I mean, seriously, who cares if so and so are or are not living together or whatever their arrangement is. If they're happy and it works for them, be happy for them. Relationships are complicated enough without adding imposed limitations and judgements. I feel it takes a lot of creativity and courage to design relationships in ways that work for the people involved. Personally, I feel people and society are evolving beyond a one size fits all system of marriage and it'll be nice to see a time when we just accept couples in whatever form they take.
 
It is truly sad, the way people's lives end up sometimes. When people get married they are often so optimistic, so hopeful of their future together. They imagine all the great things that will happen to them, such as getting a place to live together, raising children, living long enough to see their grandchildren born, and finally growing old together. My grandparents' generation did much better than my generation is currently doing, which was staying together for reasons other than one's own personal fulfillment; for the children, for security, for family, for religious reasons. Today, people aren't likely to put their own desires on hold for someone else. I don't know why that is. I have found, however, that relationships grow when you tend to them and die when you don't. I often make comparisons between house plants and relationships. What happens when you don't water them, or place them in sunlight? It is obvious what happens when we neglect things. Spouses often neglect each other. I understand that live is hard and tiring at times, but it is what you make of it. If one is too stressed, too tired, to take time for your spouse, few people ask what could they be doing different. I often ask myself, how important are these relationships to me? If I take another job that pays better, but demands longer hours, how will that affect my relationships? I've turned down some good jobs because I wouldn't see my children as often or it would place a larger burden of household affairs on my wife. But in our culture, where individuality is prized, people often choose to seek material wealth over the immaterial kind. But when is enough enough? Sure I could've taken that job, and my children would've grown up without me. I wouldn't have been able to go to the recitals, pick them up from school, intimately ask them about their day. One day, when my health started to fail me, I would look back and think "oh my, I wish I would've(not could've) spent more time with my children." But in that case, if I chose a career over them, it was that choice I made that would've changed the course of our lives. Greed would've decided our fates. Yes, I do mean greed, because I have everything I feel I need. Why do I need more than that? So I keep focused on my goals, which is to have meaningful relationships, and when I focus on that, I feel that I won't ever fear having to live separate from my spouse, our lives are one; they are intimately intertwined. I understand that people have different goals in life and often their jobs demand much of them, and if they and their spouse are fine with that then so be it. But, don't be suprised if one day the love is gone and all you have left are two separate lives trying to coexist. If anyone values their individuality that much, I would make sure their spouse would as well, otherwise I wouldn't recommend marriage.
 
Oh, I was kind of bored and so the OP was just a combination of a prank and yes, the basing off one anecdote about a situation that I don’t really have much inside information pertaining to it. :m148:
 
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