[PUG] - Suicide is Acceptable | INFJ Forum

[PUG] Suicide is Acceptable

Discussion in 'Philosophy and Religion' started by Faye, Jun 13, 2010.

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  1. Faye

    Faye ^_^
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    #1 Faye, Jun 13, 2010
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2010
  2. TinyBubbles

    TinyBubbles anarchist

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    suicide is a tragedy
    in a lot of ways because it so rarely has to happen
    there are usually better alternatives
    it causes suffering to other people, sometimes for life, and may or may not alleviate the victim's suffering, because nobody knows what happens after death
    it breaks my heart when people talk about wanting to kill themselves
    it makes me want to do something for them, anything
    i just don't want anyone to feel that desperate, that alone
    in certain extremely rare circumstances i could see it as being the lesser of two evils
    but in most cases, it's just tragic
     
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  3. Blind Bandit

    Blind Bandit Blind Man Being Lead to Nowhere
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    As crazy as it sounds I have to agree. suicide is an indication of much greater suffer than most will understand. While suffer dose hurt others. Many at the drop of the hate label that person permanently as weak, a coward, doesn't think of others. In other words they forget that someone took their own life. That is not something to belittle or ignore. Suicide should be seen what it is a cry for help. And not something to ignore or degrade.
     
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  4. arbygil

    arbygil Passing through

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    Suicidal thoughts are usually cries for help. If you've ever done a serious study or been through a study/help group regarding suicide, you'll discover that most people don't want to commit suicide - they just are so deep in their pain that they don't see the alternatives.

    The other problem is, suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. I don't believe in it - mostly because treatments exist for those who want to pursue it. I hate suicide as a final solution in 99% of the cases because it's usually someone's emotional response to a problem someone could've helped them overcome. It's the futility of it all, of the ending of a life that had the potential to be so much more.

    And then you have the folks left behind, who (on top of dealing with the tragedy) have to deal with financial situations and headaches, probate court, debt relief (if debt was part of it), and insurance companies. It's almost worse for those who are left behind, and some of those left behind may actually consider suicide as an option for them because of what they now have to do.

    In one answer to the question: Suicide is not an end to suffering. It is a transference of suffering to someone else.
     
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  5. enfp can be shy

    enfp can be shy people vs the bad people?
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    Blame is a disease which should not be spread any further. So neither the one who commits suicide, nor the society should feel guilty. That's very hard to do, within the current culture. However suicide is usually not 'okay'. Meaning that it's a signal that something must be improved in how people live, in order to reduce the probability of it recurring. To simplify the argument: you can't just marginalize the group of suicidal people. Really nothing guarantees it won't happen to your children. So, while allowing freedom and lack of shame, it should also be researched and prevented.

    http://forums.infjs.com/showthread.php?t=5021
     
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  6. Nucky

    Nucky Regular Poster

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    No matter how low, ugly, or utterly evil you feel . . . there is ALWAYS someone out there who cares about you . . . ALWAYS.

    Think about it.

    If you or anyone else you know is feeling suicidal, PLEASE get help. I solemnly swear and promise you that this is not meant in a condescending way, but in a truly caring and understanding way. You may feel utterly worthless, but, trust me, you're not to someone.
     
    #6 Nucky, Jun 13, 2010
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2010
  7. TinyBubbles

    TinyBubbles anarchist

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    i'd wager that there are many more than just one :) good post Nucky
     
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  8. Barnabas

    Barnabas Time Lord

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    Apparently some disagree, Why do I have the feeling your not aiming this at the young adult crowd? Maybe the elderly who suffer from disease there bodies can no longer fight.


    I had a teacher in highschool, he told me that suicide is a perment solution to a temporarey problem.
     
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  9. Flavus Aquila

    Flavus Aquila Finding My Place in the Sun
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    Murder - the destruction of life capable of intelligence - is so wrong because it destroys something so great and beautiful. I'm guessing that few people who suicide would ever consider murdering someone else.

    Perhaps people who suicide cannot see what they are destroying as somthing great and beautiful. In part, their innability to see the beauty of their own lives may come about because others have convinced them that they are either different or worthless in some way.

    My point is, when someone suicides, I'm guessing that many people have contributed to it by neglect or abuse.
     
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  10. Gaze

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    yup. this is the real issue, rather than whether or no they shouldn't do it. The world today treats people as if they are disposable. How can that not affect people?

    And comments here imply that someone who considers suicide doesn't see the big picture or doesn't consider the consequence to themselves or others? How do we know this? There are too many assumptions or judgments being made.
     
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  11. Tactical Panda

    Tactical Panda Community Member

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    Is OP slightly suicidal or is this a purely theoretical discussion? :m075:
     
  12. Shai Gar

    Shai Gar Guest

    My grandfather committed suicide. I supported that action 100% we always want more time with the victim because we know that we won't ever get time again.

    But his cancer was terminal and he had been suffering for 20 years, the last 2 in complete agony on Morphine. Just a damn shame they couldn't give him heroin. Stupid fucking malem prohibitum laws.
     
  13. Shai Gar

    Shai Gar Guest

    My grandfather committed suicide. I supported that action 100%. We always want more time with the victim because we know that we won't ever get time again.

    But his cancer was terminal and he had been suffering for 20 years, the last 2 in complete agony on Morphine. Just a damn shame they couldn't give him heroin. Stupid fucking malem prohibitum laws.
     
  14. invisible

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    what do you think dragon
     
  15. On my own path

    On my own path Community Member

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    +1

    Society seems to me to at times treat people as unemotional robots. I remember the thread it had sometime ago and I recalled anecdotes mentioned about "niceness" being frowned upon. It seems as thought there is a disdain for being "soft" in many facets of society. This disdain is perhaps so intense- yet subtle- insofar as to try to expunge being "soft" out of people by "toughening them up" by virtue of indifference. Some conform and others do not. Those that sense that there feelings are being invalidated may internalise negative ones and that internalisation can lead to a sense of worthlessness which can lead one to consider suicide.

    The most heart breaking aspect may be that people who attempt suicide or commit suicide are then disparaged and called "weak". As such some considering suicide may rather suffer in silence rather than seek help and further internalise their negative feelings. It is a very sad and destructive cycle
     
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  16. Gaze

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    This^^^
     
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  17. bamf

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    As Arby said, suicide is often a cry for help. A lot of people who commit suicide are in a somewhat blind state of mind, and haven't fully committed to it.

    It's a really touchy subject for me, that I'm emotionally invested in. It really strikes close to home for me, because of my experiences. I can't speak for anyone else, but I often think that the situations building up to suicide are reconcilable, and suicide is not needed (in a majority of cases) Like other people have mentioned, society plays a part in this. We have a culture where success is measured by money, and it's mostly an everyone for themselves type deal. I'm not saying capitalism makes suicide, but there is a mindset of a constant uphill struggle, and worthlessness that can be pervasive.

    Suicide is a highly personal decision. In some cases, I fully support it. Terminally ill, elderly who have lost abilities to function properly, coma patients and life-support patients, to name a few. Suicide that is done out of depression/the-likes is highly regrettable, and the waves travel far. However, I think it's a disservice to view their life as a tragedy, and it's short-sighted to call them weak. Our life is ultimately our own decision, and our choices always affect someone else.
     
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  18. On my own path

    On my own path Community Member

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    I think there are a lot of social constructs regarding people that lead to suicide. The aspect I mentioned with regards to being considered "weak" is just one. Another is being considered a "freak". If someone feel is being margainalised in society for opposing a norm and they notice that while other causes garner large amounts of supporters and proponets yet their feelings of being margainalised are going unrecognised, considered irrelevant , or are being invalidated, such people may feel outcasted and repudiated. As apparently no one cares about their pain they feel as though they are worthless. Some conform, others do not. Those that do not can go through life feeling as though no one can ever understand them or will even try. They can feel disconnected from other people and unwanted, unappreciated, or just downright loathed. And thus feel depressed insofar as to desire to end their life. They begin to think that no one would understand their pain, they do not discuss it or reach out- perhaps even rejecting those that reach out them. And perhaps end their life. The destructive cycle then continues as the person who took their own life can be considered mentally ill; which leads to their violation of the norm being labeled as sign of mental illness, further leading to repudiation and ostracisation of such individuals. And the disconcerting cycle continues
     
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  19. the

    the Si master race.
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    whered the OP go?
     
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  20. slant

    slant Sedated slanty

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    who am i to determine the moral/non moral implications of anything, nonetheless suicide?
     
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