Should we go to war with Russia to save the economy?

[slant]

I'm sure there are other "reasons" people want to go to war in Russia and feel free to discuss them, but the fact remains that world war 2 definitely helped recover the economy. Can a war with Russia fix this COVID economy bubble we created and should we do it? I don't think we have a choice anyway (hope I'm wrong!) So how excited are you to go to war

 

[aeon]

1. No, the situation is far different, and the post-WW2 economy in the US rapidly grew because of the GI Bill and a top-tier tax rate of 90%, among many other things.
2. Not at all.

Cheers,
Ian

 

[Cornerstone]

There's nothing in it for anyone who would actually do the fighting. Never was, never will be. We're close-ish addressing the 'systemic' nature of things but the actual system, i.e. gangsters with no intention of sharing running everything on all sides, is just to big to do anything about. The least we can do is not kill and die for them.

 

[slant]

There's nothing in it for anyone who would actually do the fighting. Never was, never will be. We're close-ish addressing the 'systemic' nature of things but the actual system, i.e. gangsters with no intention of sharing running everything on all sides, is just to big to do anything about. The least we can do is not kill and die for them.

What, people won't make money off the war?

 

[slant]

1. No, the situation is far different, and the post-WW2 economy in the US rapidly grew because of the GI Bill and a top-tier tax rate of 90%, among many other things.
2. Not at all.

Cheers,
Ian

What war since world war 2 didn't stimulate the economy though? I hear the war in Iraq was seriously lucrative for government contractors. Not liking war and not thinking a war is productive is different than the economic realities of the military industrial complex

 

[Misty]

There's nothing in it for anyone who would actually do the fighting. Never was, never will be. We're close-ish addressing the 'systemic' nature of things but the actual system, i.e. gangsters with no intention of sharing running everything on all sides, is just to big to do anything about. The least we can do is not kill and die for them.

This^

 

[aeon]

If you mean economy of and for the wealthy, war is tops.

But war means bodies of poor people. They do not benefit.

In the time I have been an adult, there have been three wars.
Shortly after each, the economy in the US went into recession.

No Thanks,
Ian

 

[slant]

If you mean economy of and for the wealthy, war is tops.

But war means bodies of poor people. They do not benefit.

In the time I have been an adult, there have been three wars.
Shortly after each, the economy in the US went into recession.

No Thanks,
Ian

Some would argue the recession happened because the wars ended and stopped artificially pumping parts of the market

 

[Cornerstone]

What, people won't make money off the war?

There might be benefits if there is an end to it that isn't sticks and stones but nothing that couldn't be gained without going to war.

In the UK, arguably the main reason we have the vote and NHS and welfare system was to keep us from going bananas after the world wars.

It's a gain, sure, and would've taken longer otherwise, but anything that happens now is bullshit like WW1.

WW2 was different but a direct result of lack of foresight by people who were meant to be the most educated and blah blah blah.

The UK is fucked too but Russia is not the enemy. Pathology masquerading as the only viable option and centuries of gaslighting on a massive level is the real enemy. We have to collectively admit that we've been massively duped for a long, long time and I think that is the biggest barrier. Incidentally, it's also the sin of sins...pride.

 

[Misty]

If all the crooked politicians who we voted in to serve us, not the other way around, and their wealthy corporate sponsors, the WEF, and the nefarious plans of the 1% would share instead of reap, we wouldn't need wars and dead soldiers to stimulate the economy.

Most of those soldiers laying their lives on the line are living on low income, themselves. It's a broken system built on corruption and corporate greed. It's gross.

 

[slant]

There might be benefits if there is an end to it that isn't sticks and stones but nothing that couldn't be gained without going to war.

In the UK, arguably the main reason we have the vote and NHS and welfare system was to keep us from going bananas after the world wars.

It's a gain, sure, and would've taken longer otherwise, but anything that happens now is bullshit like WW1.

WW2 was different but a direct result of lack of foresight by people who were meant to be the most educated and blah blah blah.

The UK is fucked too but Russia is not the enemy. Pathology masquerading as the only viable option and centuries of gaslighting on a massive level is the real enemy. We have to collectively admit that we've been massively duped for a long, long time and I think that is the biggest barrier. Incidentally, it's also the sin of sins...pride.

There's 0 chances of this happening in the us lol maybe the UK will be wiser. I agree with you, but the "regular" folks I talk to all think Russia is doing Bad Things TM and somebody needs to stop them. Ugh.

 

[slant]

If all the crooked politicians who we voted in to serve us, not the other way around, and their wealthy corporate sponsors, the WEF and the nefarious plans of the 1% would share instead of reap, we wouldn't need wars and dead soldiers to stimulate the economy. Most of those soldiers laying their lives on the line, living on low income, themselves. It's a broken system built on corruption and corporate greed. It's gross.

Has there been any other system in the history of human beings? I'm just asking to point out that I don't know if humans have never *not* done this. Even if you can point out a single society, on a global level, there has never been a time in written history where there was not a war going on somewhere. What we're discussing is a utopian society that has never existed as far as we know of. And my question is: is it even possible?

Because I don't actually think it is.

Which then poses the question: if it is just in human nature to do these things and it can't be stopped, is there an actual solution?

 

[TheDeathOfYouAndMe]

Unless the politicians plan on entering an arena and fighting amongst themselves then no, it is always the blood of innocents that pay the price of war. Avoid at all cost otherwise.

 

[Pin]

If Russia invades Ukraine, yes. But not to "save the economy." The idea of war saving economies sounds like rhetoric or a talking point with little historical basis.

 

[Misty]

Has there been any other system in the history of human beings? I'm just asking to point out that I don't know if humans have never *not* done this. Even if you can point out a single society, on a global level, there has never been a time in written history where there was not a war going on somewhere. What we're discussing is a utopian society that has never existed as far as we know of. And my question is: is it even possible?

Because I don't actually think it is.

Which then poses the question: if it is just in human nature to do these things and it can't be stopped, is there an actual solution?

I don't want to live in a utopian society run by the WEF, where we'll have squat and be happy. Their utopia is not the majority's, obviously.

In order for any sort of utopian society to succeed there would need to be real freedom, real democracy, and accountability.. an equalization of power, if you will. This would also need to involve a system of checks and balances to ensure no one in power is corrupt and all involved have pure and good intentions.

So the answer is, no.

I think people are awake now though, thanks to Corona. And that's a good place to start. If you're asleep at the wheel, you'll happily follow the flute of the leaders right into signing away your own freedoms.

The media is only perpetuating the story those in power are pedaling. Major news is owned by these same corporations, Pfizer, Moderna.. it's all a show.

 

[Peppermint]

I'd rather not.

 

[Cornerstone]

There's 0 chances of this happening in the us lol maybe the UK will be wiser. I agree with you, but the "regular" folks I talk to all think Russia is doing Bad Things TM and somebody needs to stop them. Ugh.

It sounds cold but there's one born every minute. If you sign up for the military without really understanding the absurdity of having to defend an ally nation under any circumstances then you were exactly what they were looking for.

The state can never stop me being a communist with the people around me unless they kill me or get in my head something savage. I wobble and falter all the time but, ultimately, the question is the same. Who is your neighbour? The Russian people, the Chinese people, the American people etc are not the state and are not the establishment.

The lines are super blurred here but at least we have pretty clear class distinctions. The people still have nothing to lose but their chains, they've just developed a bondage fetish.

 

[Pin]

I'd rather not.

I'd love to know what your take on the whole situation is.

 

[Cornerstone]

Sorry to go on but until we resolve the exploiter/expolitee relationship at the interpersonal level we'll keep projecting it onto the national and geopolitical level.

Who wants to admit they're an exploiter? Who wants to admit they've been exploited? Even if we can learn the truth, can we face it? On an individual level, with people we know, because we've almost certainly been both at some point.

Not to say it's not happening at global levels but our investment in it at that level which we have no control over is symptomatic of our refusal to recognise it on our home turf, with our so-called loved ones.

 

[Roses In The Vineyard]

I'll just cut it quick that I've been studying scenarios like this since the mid 2000s and frankly if the two nations went to war it would be a suicidal act for neither would recover from should things escalate enough. I will just be blunt that anyone suggesting this to be a good idea is of poor character or worse and likely wouldn't survive as large swath of the population wouldn't either. The last thing this ailing empire needs is another big war never mind small regional wars acting as a big drain on an already overstretched military that would later open the door to invasion given how nonexistent our leadership is. I really don't fancy North America being invaded because of some shit bags wanted to make an extra buck or for political gain plus any fool would miss over the fact that a major war with Russia at this time would in time involve China as well though they are more careful unlike the retards running the western world right now. One should also consider how much this could fuck over Canada and Mexico should the millions of Americans decide to jump ship. As for Europe if this happens they are as fucked as it gets in the long run. By the way all those smaller nations that depended on the US for defense are sitting ducks once the conflict really gets going especially Australia.

I really do fail to understand how anyone can sleep easy with knowing that another world war would kill off several billion people along with wrecking this planet's biosphere as if it is a good thing.