Selfishness or Self Preservation?

[Wildfire]

I was born with a disease that would always complicate my life but it wasn't inevitable that it would become disabling. But while I was still young I was hit by a car and the combination of the two made that outcome more probable. Still, it wasn't until a few years ago that it became official as far as the Social Security Administration was concerned. And then, much more recently, it became very real to me when my lumbar fusion fell apart.

It's probably easiest to just place me in the same category as someone who has suffered a spinal cord injury and know that I had to start using a wheelchair back in January. And the truth is that even though I knew this was likely I'm having a really hard time adjusting, on so many levels.

Anyway, there is one area in particular that I'm trying to figure out how to navigate and I know that talking, or in this case writing about it, might help. At the very least it'll probably help me figure out exactly what I feel, regardless of what you all have to say on the subject, but please do speak your truth. Insight is valuable.

So this is all about the fact that I love to kayak. There really is nothing I love more and no place I'd rather be. No other activity can enliven and anchor me at the same time. It grounds me in nature like nothing else. It's where I feel most alive and most myself. And I'm longing for it now more than ever.

The problem isn't really figuring out how to do it. In truth, kayaks and wheelchairs have a lot in common. And the problem isn't even finding safe places. Flat water lakes abound. The problem is a husband who is freaked out by the idea and I can't seem to punch through the guilt I'm feeling causing him to worry. So I'm stuck until I can navigate that.

Thoughts?

 

[G4RiiM]

I was born with a disease that would always complicate my life but it wasn't inevitable that it would become disabling. But while I was still young I was hit by a car and the combination of the two made that outcome more probable. Still, it wasn't until a few years ago that it became official as far as the Social Security Administration was concerned. And then, much more recently, it became very real to me when my lumbar fusion fell apart.

It's probably easiest to just place me in the same category as someone who has suffered a spinal cord injury and know that I had to start using a wheelchair back in January. And the truth is that even though I knew this was likely I'm having a really hard time adjusting, on so many levels.

Anyway, there is one area in particular that I'm trying to figure out how to navigate and I know that talking, or in this case writing about it, might help. At the very least it'll probably help me figure out exactly what I feel, regardless of what you all have to say on the subject, but please do speak your truth. Insight is valuable.

So this is all about the fact that I love to kayak. There really is nothing I love more and no place I'd rather be. No other activity can enliven and anchor me at the same time. It grounds me in nature like nothing else. It's where I feel most alive and most myself. And I'm longing for it now more than ever.

The problem isn't really figuring out how to do it. In truth, kayaks and wheelchairs have a lot in common. And the problem isn't even finding safe places. Flat water lakes abound. The problem is a husband who is freaked out by the idea and I can't seem to punch through the guilt I'm feeling causing him to worry. So I'm stuck until I can navigate that.

Thoughts?

what freaks him out about it?

 

[PapillonT]

The problem isn't really figuring out how to do it. In truth, kayaks and wheelchairs have a lot in common. And the problem isn't even finding safe places. Flat water lakes abound. The problem is a husband who is freaked out by the idea and I can't seem to punch through the guilt I'm feeling causing him to worry. So I'm stuck until I can navigate that.

Thoughts?

From personal experience, I've come to understand that your loved ones almost always automatically shift to fear and worry and treating you as though you're made of glass in situations like these. So it could take a while for them to come to understand your point, but it is possible.
Can you try to talk to him from that perspective of understanding his fear? Maybe he'd be more accepting and assured if you would do this together?
It could also help if you could explain why you really need to do this, for yourself (reasons beyond simply liking the sport).

 

[Deleted member 16771]

The problem isn't really figuring out how to do it. In truth, kayaks and wheelchairs have a lot in common. And the problem isn't even finding safe places. Flat water lakes abound. The problem is a husband who is freaked out by the idea and I can't seem to punch through the guilt I'm feeling causing him to worry. So I'm stuck until I can navigate that.

Thoughts?

I would be freaked out, too.

I'm not going to weigh in on an opinion just yet, but I do have a personal perspective to share.

My first girlfriend was mad about kayaking, too, so I understand the passion. It was pretty much her life. She was an amazing kayaker, and very experienced.

However, ten years ago she was killed in an accident that involved a capsize and not being able to right herself. Of course, it devastated everybody who knew her with grief, and wrecked me for a long long time.

Now, in her case she wasn't paddling on 'flat water' - it was a high-flow river pumped by heavy rain. Even so, I think you know that the manoeuvre to right oneself involves some serious spinal flexion, and a jerking motion that I would worry that you aren't capable of. (Stabilising the boat also involves the spine, though there are ways to do it for less-abled people, too.)

All it would take would be a moment of inattentiveness from your fellow paddlers, and a capsize you couldn't recover from, and there you are gone.

If I were your husband, I would share my concerns with you, and the risks, and remind you of your responsibilities (for example, if we had any children or other dependents), although of course I wouldn't 'stop you' if it was a rational choice you had made yourself to do something you truly loved. In fact, I would support you paddling and try to make it as safe as possible (perhaps some retraining in closed pools first?), though there's no question that I would be shit scared.

I'm already afraid for you and your husband and I don't even know you, but that's my history influencing my impression.

Whatever you decide, it should be for the right reasons, and I hope that you fully consider every eventuality. If you decide not to, though, don't resent him, just remember that you will have made a choice for your own safety. Ultimately it's up to you, so good luck

 

[Cornerstone]

I was going to say something similar about doing some practice just to put his mind at ease a bit. Once he sees that you are capable of staying as safe as possible he might come around, especially as it was something you did before.

Then, if he's still like that, you can honestly say that his fear is his problem which, of course, you can attempt to help him with, but which you don't have to feel excessive guilt about.

 

[Wildfire]

what freaks him out about it?

So far all he's been able to say is that he's concerned about my safety, which I get, but he hasn't been able to be more specific, which I need so that I can help to address his fears.

From personal experience, I've come to understand that your loved ones almost always automatically shift to fear and worry and treating you as though you're made of glass in situations like these. So it could take a while for them to come to understand your point, but it is possible.
Can you try to talk to him from that perspective of understanding his fear? Maybe he'd be more accepting and assured if you would do this together?
It could also help if you could explain why you really need to do this, for yourself (reasons beyond simply liking the sport).

Your experience is the same as mine then, and while their intentions are incredibly sweet they can also be annoying as hell. Lol

And you're right about addressing his fear, but since he hasn't been able to figure out what he feels he's not giving me much to work with. I'm also open to the idea of doing it together. He really doesn't enjoy it though, and can be a total curmudgeon. But I do think that giving him the option is a good idea, and his fears could be put to rest after he witnesses me still doing what I used to do.

Getting him to understand why I need this feels impossible at this point.

I was going to say something similar about doing some practice just to put his mind at ease a bit. Once he sees that you are capable of staying as safe as possible he might come around, especially as it was something you did before.

Then, if he's still like that, you can honestly say that his fear is his problem which, of course, you can attempt to help him with, but which you don't have to feel excessive guilt about.

I think you've pretty much nailed it @Cornerstone. And I think I'm feeling a lot of guilt about "what I'm putting everybody through" in general, and this is just another layer for me to sort through.

 

[G4RiiM]

So far all he's been able to say is that he's concerned about my safety, which I get, but he hasn't been able to be more specific, which I need so that I can help to address his fears.

Your experience is the same as mine then, and while their intentions are incredibly sweet they can also be annoying as hell. Lol

And you're right about addressing his fear, but since he hasn't been able to figure out what he feels he's not giving me much to work with. I'm also open to the idea of doing it together. He really doesn't enjoy it though, and can be a total curmudgeon. But I do think that giving him the option is a good idea, and his fears could be put to rest after he witnesses me still doing what I used to do.

Getting him to understand why I need this feels impossible at this point.

I think you've pretty much nailed it @Cornerstone. And I think I'm feeling a lot of guilt about "what I'm putting everybody through" in general, and this is just another layer for me to sort through.

maybe u can get some kayak modified to your needs.. maybe let him test it first until he is satisfied.. dont take for granted the ones that love u the most

 

[PapillonT]

Your experience is the same as mine then, and while their intentions are incredibly sweet they can also be annoying as hell. Lol

And you're right about addressing his fear, but since he hasn't been able to figure out what he feels he's not giving me much to work with. I'm also open to the idea of doing it together. He really doesn't enjoy it though, and can be a total curmudgeon. But I do think that giving him the option is a good idea, and his fears could be put to rest after he witnesses me still doing what I used to do.

Getting him to understand why I need this feels impossible at this point.

Well, yes, but as your husband in this case, they only behave in such way because they love us.
Generally, I think that in situations of adversity people do feel fear for themselves, but (even if they are in pain themselves) that is nothing compared to the fear or pain people experience for someone they care about who might be in suffering and pain or in danger. People are never truly ready for that.
I don't mean we should completely comply with their advice for that reason only, but acknowledging that side is very important, both for communication and for relationships. At least, those are my thoughts or how I choose to understand this

I hope you two find some middle ground.

 

[Wildfire]

I would be freaked out, too.

I'm not going to weigh in on an opinion just yet, but I do have a personal perspective to share.

My first girlfriend was mad about kayaking, too, so I understand the passion. It was pretty much her life. She was an amazing kayaker, and very experienced.

However, ten years ago she was killed in an accident that involved a capsize and not being able to right herself. Of course, it devastated everybody who knew her with grief, and wrecked me for a long long time.

Now, in her case she wasn't paddling on 'flat water' - it was a high-flow river pumped by heavy rain. Even so, I think you know that the manoeuvre to right oneself involves some serious spinal flexion, and a jerking motion that I would worry that you aren't capable of. (Stabilising the boat also involves the spine, though there are ways to do it for less-abled people, too.)

All it would take would be a moment of inattentiveness from your fellow paddlers, and a capsize you couldn't recover from, and there you are gone.

If I were your husband, I would share my concerns with you, and the risks, and remind you of your responsibilities (for example, if we had any children or other dependents), although of course I wouldn't 'stop you' if it was a rational choice you had made yourself to do something you truly loved. In fact, I would support you paddling and try to make it as safe as possible (perhaps some retraining in closed pools first?), though there's no question that I would be shit scared.

I'm already afraid for you and your husband and I don't even know you, but that's my history influencing my impression.

Whatever you decide, it should be for the right reasons, and I hope that you fully consider every eventuality. If you decide not to, though, don't resent him, just remember that you will have made a choice for your own safety. Ultimately it's up to you, so good luck

Thank you for this reply @Deleted member 16771. I'm very sorry for your loss and can see why this would hit close to home for you.

Know that the things you've mentioned are all things that I'm very aware of and I don't see myself on anything other than flat water at this point. Thankfully, holding myself in a seated position really isn't a problem for me, and I can use an open cock pit kayak specifically so that I don't get trapped. It would be nice if falling into the water and getting back on the kayak a few times would do the trick when it comes to addressing his fears, but I'm not hopeful. It seems to be something deeper. But doing nothing is not an option for me, so I will try.

 

[Pin]

Maybe there's an alternative sport out there.

 

[Wildfire]

Maybe there's an alternative sport out there.

Yeah, no.

 

[Pin]

Yeah, no.

Ok, if it means that much to you.

 

[Wildfire]

Ok, if it means that much to you.

Thank you. That's exactly what I need to hear.

 

[Wildfire]

Maybe there's an alternative sport out there.

This actually did get me thinking though. This doesn't have to be viewed as something as daunting as participating in a sport. It feels more like lounging on the water at this point, with the option to meander here and there and lounge some more.

 

[slant]

You know what you want to do already. What you need to do is give yourself permission to do something that someone you love doesn't like. In all relationships, friendships, familial, romantic, we have disagreements and it's that love that pushes us to accept hard decisions.

 

[Wildfire]

You know what you want to do already. What you need to do is give yourself permission to do something that someone you love doesn't like. In all relationships, friendships, familial, romantic, we have disagreements and it's that love that pushes us to accept hard decisions.

All true, but I'm having a really hard time giving myself that permission. It has something to do with the idea of being "fair" to him, feeling like nothing about any of this has been "fair" to him, while simultaneously feeling it isn't "fair" to me either. In case you haven't noticed I'm trying to figure out where this particular idea of "fairness" is rooted and what to replace it with, because it doesn't seem to serve the situation very well.

 

[Cornerstone]

All true, but I'm having a really hard time giving myself that permission. It has something to do with the idea of being "fair" to him, feeling like nothing about any of this has been "fair" to him, while simultaneously feeling it isn't "fair" to me either. In case you haven't noticed I'm trying to figure out where this particular idea of "fairness" is rooted and what to replace it with, because it doesn't seem to serve the situation very well.

Have you talked honestly about how your now being in a wheelchair has/is affecting him? If not, are you really ready to have that conversation? It's the sort of conversation which, I think, would benefit from the presence of an impartial person like a counselor or therapist of some kind. A person's thoughts aren't their beliefs but they can be difficult to hear and process even knowing that.

You're right though, it's not fair on either of you. However, if you have needed a wheelchair since January that's really not a very long time and I think it's fair that neither of you will have fully accepted your unfair situation yet.

Where do you think you and he are in terms of the five stages of grief? Denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance. It's not just about death but the loss of anything including imagined future plans and possibilities.

 

[pzl2lxie81mc]

I think practically, things you could do to help ameliorate his fears as some people have mentioned, like say, start off in a pool so he can see that you can handle a kayak in calm waters in a safe setting. Or, maybe changing from a kayak to something else that is more stable. Aren’t there ones with buoys on both sides, like training wheels? I don’t know, I’m just throwing ideas out.

It would help to know what he’s specifically afraid of. But, that could be hard to get at and no one really likes talking about what really makes them feel afraid, and I don’t mean spiders. Your reassurances aren’t going to make much of a difference if he doesn’t believe them. And so, that’s the divide.

 

[Wildfire]

Have you talked honestly about how your now being in a wheelchair has/is affecting him? If not, are you really ready to have that conversation? It's the sort of conversation which, I think, would benefit from the presence of an impartial person like a counselor or therapist of some kind. A person's thoughts aren't their beliefs but they can be difficult to hear and process even knowing that.

You're right though, it's not fair on either of you. However, if you have needed a wheelchair since January that's really not a very long time and I think it's fair that neither of you will have fully accepted your unfair situation yet.

Where do you think you and he are in terms of the five stages of grief? Denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance. It's not just about death but the loss of anything including imagined future plans and possibilities.

I've actually been disabled for a number of years, but this is a new level of impairment. Still, I've been grieving losses and adjusting expectations for some time. And I think I'm doing reasonably well with it all. We've been together for almost 20 years so he's had some experience with it too. And we did go to counseling in the past, so I know he has a framework for coping. You are right that it hasn't been very long though, and we're still adjusting to our new normal. Still I'm bugged by my hang up over fairness. I feel like that points to something important for me while navigating this. It seems like I've basically accepted the whole "life isn't fair thing" for myself but I'm still looking for it to be fair to others, and especially to the ones I love. Maybe? Not quite sure.

 

[slant]

[

All true, but I'm having a really hard time giving myself that permission. It has something to do with the idea of being "fair" to him, feeling like nothing about any of this has been "fair" to him, while simultaneously feeling it isn't "fair" to me either. In case you haven't noticed I'm trying to figure out where this particular idea of "fairness" is rooted and what to replace it with, because it doesn't seem to serve the situation very well.

Well, maybe try thinking about it from the "Third perspective" like I am doing. I don't know you guys so all I can do is look at the situation based on facts with no attachment to what the outcome is.

There's no "fair" because there's no right or wrong in this situation.

Two people are married. One person wants to pursue a hobby, and the spouse doesn't want the person to do so because he is afraid of dangers. Some of the dangers may have legitimacy and the person who wants to do the hobby acknowledged them and has a plan to deal with them. The spouse doesn't think this is good enough or that it is safe. The spouse is upset, the person who wants to pursue the hobby feels conflicted about it.

Both perspectives are valid.

You could prepare for potential dangers and it still might be dangerous.

Your husband could be afraid that you'll get hurt and it might be perfectly safe.

All this is, is a disagreement. You both should be able to eventually accept each other's feelings and decisions, whatever they may be. I know it's stressful and you likely are having a lot of conversations in your head about what sort of person this makes you, as the title of this thread mentions "selfish" and so there's some aspect of you that feels you're being selfish, maybe you've been told you're being selfish by someone else.

But there's nothing wrong with you wanting to pursue your hobby.

And there's nothing wrong with your husband being concerned and thinking you shouldn't do it.

This doesn't make you selfish, or your husband overly cautious, it just means you see the situation differently and disagree and you both have that right. The question is how do you both respect each other's feelings while also making the decisions you need to make.