Money Management | INFJ Forum

Money Management

Honey

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Apr 16, 2009
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I want to talk about money a little. I have dreadful problems keeping hold of mine. I work long hours and make quite decent money yet when I consult my savings and bank account, I am shock and disappointed in myself. I just do not have a good handle on managing money and I feel like I am working for nothing sometimes. I have tried putting myself on a budget but little unexpected things kept coming up. In my favor is that I am very strict with myself about avoiding debt and I have very little of that consequently.

I fear that I am going to be a broke old woman with nothing to my name if this continues and I am from a very small family so I will not have much back up. My grandfather also made a very good income when he was young and nearly dead in poverty and it was frightening. My mother (who I did not grow up with) also squandered her money and is now starting from stratch after wasting hers.

I grew up with SJs and they were very good with money and their clothes, food and so on were really no worst that mine. I ask my sensor friends who are good with money how they do it and they cannot seem to explain it... it just comes naturally to them. An INFJ with great financial management skill who can help me with this problem would really be appreciated. Please explain in very great detail how you do it if you can. Sensors can help me too, I just want to improve in this area desperately and quickly.
 
I hope someone can help you with that :) I know the feeling of thinking of yourself as being and old broke lady, I used to worry about it, but not anymore. I didnt get any richer, I just changed the way I looked at it.
 
If you online bank, most banks now have ways for you to print out tables showing where your money is going. Once you see where it is being wasted, you know how to plan to save. I wasn't always good with money, my sensor husband has rubbed off on me in this respect ... there was no negotiation. lol

Most families I know waste the most of their money in dining out. How to solve that? Plan meals for the week and buy accordingly.

The most difficult thing to do is to curb your impulse to spend, you need to direct that energy some other way.

Consulting with a financial adviser is normally free. Try it. :) If you are concerned about retirement, they can help you.
 
I'm a college student so my situation is more about maintaining than flourishing, but here's what I do to manage money:

  • Prescience. Carry an agenda everywhere and plot every significant transaction for the upcoming month.
  • Regulation. Construct a financial priorities flowchart to keep in mind everything that must be paid on a regular (monthly/whatever) basis.
  • Minimalizing. Create a spreadsheet or pie chart for financial distributions, i.e see where your money's going. Shave off junk and redistribute to what is required, especially long-term payments like cars and such. Budget like a miser and never spend more than you have.

Basically, it's just a matter of tracking your input/output and having self-discipline. Pairing the above with diligently recording your spendings (I do it every night but that's just me) lets me stay above water and able to safely splurge from time to time when I know it won't get me in trouble. Student part-time salary ftw! ^.^

(As a side-note, I tend to think money management is an exposure and necessity thing. My mother is an ENFJ and has had an iron grip on every dollar since she was a teenager. Household spendings are planned weeks, if not months, in advance for security and to allow wiggle-room for those "must haz shiny" moments we all love so much ;) She always knows to expect and, even when thrown a curveball, can adapt The Masterplan to suit. As her INFJ kid, I'm just as obsessive about stability; knowledge is power, and knowing what will come helps us both live more freely in the now. I admit that it was somewhat annoying at first to regulate myself so much but I realized it was for the best longitudinally.)

I hope some of this was at least somewhat useful. [MENTION=4423]Sriracha[/MENTION] has awesome advice.

Best wishes!
 
I'm a college student so my situation is more about maintaining than flourishing, but here's what I do to manage money:

  • Prescience. Carry an agenda everywhere and plot every significant transaction for the upcoming month.
  • Regulation. Construct a financial priorities flowchart to keep in mind everything that must be paid on a regular (monthly/whatever) basis.
  • Minimalizing. Create a spreadsheet or pie chart for financial distributions, i.e see where your money's going. Shave off junk and redistribute to what is required, especially long-term payments like cars and such. Budget like a miser and never spend more than you have.

Basically, it's just a matter of tracking your input/output and having self-discipline. Pairing the above with diligently recording your spendings (I do it every night but that's just me) lets me stay above water and able to safely splurge from time to time when I know it won't get me in trouble. Student part-time salary ftw! ^.^

(As a side-note, I tend to think money management is an exposure and necessity thing. My mother is an ENFJ and has had an iron grip on every dollar since she was a teenager. Household spendings are planned weeks, if not months, in advance for security and to allow wiggle-room for those "must haz shiny" moments we all love so much ;) She always knows to expect and, even when thrown a curveball, can adapt The Masterplan to suit. As her INFJ kid, I'm just as obsessive about stability; knowledge is power, and knowing what will come helps us both live more freely in the now. I admit that it was somewhat annoying at first to regulate myself so much but I realized it was for the best longitudinally.)

I hope some of this was at least somewhat useful. @Sriracha has awesome advice.

Best wishes!

I like your idea of diligently recording your spending every night. I sense that that might help me. I will really try to stick to doing that and see how it goes. I think I too will find it a bit annoying especially since at the moment I am having to be rigidly controlling myself in quite a few other practical areas. My Se 4th function can get out of control in a number of areas I have come to realise so I am trying to manage it better...I am really a closet hedonist with all that that involves.

I have an ENFJ friend who is also really good with money, she was one of the people who I asked for suggestions from on this matter. According to her she just gets really excited at the end of the month when she looks in her back account & sees that she has spent very little the month before. I, on the other hand, seem to have a semi-conscious compulsion to spend as much as possible of what I have and I am really seeing this as self destructive now. Thanks for your suggestion.
 
If you online bank, most banks now have ways for you to print out tables showing where your money is going. Once you see where it is being wasted, you know how to plan to save. I wasn't always good with money, my sensor husband has rubbed off on me in this respect ... there was no negotiation. lol

Most families I know waste the most of their money in dining out. How to solve that? Plan meals for the week and buy accordingly.

The most difficult thing to do is to curb your impulse to spend, you need to direct that energy some other way.

Consulting with a financial adviser is normally free. Try it. :) If you are concerned about retirement, they can help you.

I have tried to control my impulse to spend but at the time I am spending, I feel like the thing I want is some kind of necessity and if I am having a bad day or something I frequently go shopping on my way home and buy something to brighten up my day I guess. Of course, this is ridiculous but I have only recently noticed that that is what I have been doing. I do not buy meaningless trinkets or anything like that but I buy a lot of clothes and I used to eat away from home a lot but I have cut down totally on that thankfully. However, that change was more to do with something gross that I saw the service staff do in a restaurant which helped to stop that habit.

I will see if I can arrange a meeting with a financial advisor at my bank, I never considered that before and that is an excellent suggestion. I think I can see a lot more advance planning in my future. Restricting myself & 'freedom' always seems to mentally conjure up the image of someone with constipation in my mind automatically lol.
 
I hope someone can help you with that :) I know the feeling of thinking of yourself as being and old broke lady, I used to worry about it, but not anymore. I didnt get any richer, I just changed the way I looked at it.

Moonlightam, how do you look at it now?

One of the things that I am noticing about this site is that there is not really a lot of topics relating to practical matters which is kind of understandably considering the population here. I think a lot of the self development I am focused on at the moment is related to acquiring skills which the great majority of SJ types are naturally good at.
 
Moonlightam, how do you look at it now?

One of the things that I am noticing about this site is that there is not really a lot of topics relating to practical matters which is kind of understandably considering the population here. I think a lot of the self development I am focused on at the moment is related to acquiring skills which the great majority of SJ types are naturally good at.

one thing has popped in my mind that might help you - on paydays I used to pay all bills and stuff first, the see how much have I left over, and then divide the sum for the rest of the month, so I always knew I had £xx to spend each day and no more. If I didnt spend as much one day - I could treat myself the next and so on. If you need to put something aside - then pay all necessities, decide how much you are putting aside, and then see how much you are left with for each day of the rest of the month.

And the way I look at it now is kind of non-materialistic, really, I live through the day not worrying about having anything to my name, being old or not. I simply came to the conclusion that I really dont NEED all these clothes, shoes, bags, etc. If I go out somewhere and feel tempted to buy something, I always think 9 times - do I really need it, how much do I need it, could I do without? So, I rarely buy anything, and if I do buy - I make sure that its gonna last, never buy cheap shite, cuz u end up paying twice in the end anyway. One thing I cant resist though is traveling :) I can go a loooong way without a lot of what most people consider necessities, just so I can get a break away from this depressing city. Even living below the poverty level like I do, I still manage to do that :D At the end of the day, my priorities are different from most people's, I'd rather sit in my chair old and poor, without anything to my name, but having a lot of good memories of how I lived my life :)
 
The funny thing about money is that the more you have, the more inclined you are to spend. Live within your means, and only purchase things you only truly need or want. These days there is so much free entertainment you should be able to fill up a lot of necessities in life with just the internet.
 
I read somewhere that INFJ's are not good with money. I am decent with money and can pay my bills, shop thrifty, and still get things I want but saving isn't my gift. I was doing good until I had to spend it on a lawyer, tires, a battery, etc. I am needing the same advice but I think I need someone doing it for me! LOL
 
In order to save you have to consistently live below your means. I've done this by figuring out how much I want to save, and then making a monthly budget that includes that savings. You do need to figure out where your money is going to make the budget. If you're spending $75 a week eating out, then you'll want to include some money for dining in your budget, but maybe you can make your own coffee and bring that down to $60 a week. One trick I learned (from a Dave Ramsey groupie) was to use cash for as many of your budgeted items (like eating out) as possible. It's easier to stay on budget that way because when the cash is gone, you know you have to eat at home for the rest of the week. Also, make sure to include some kind of general "spending money" category in your budget, even if its just $20 a week, so you can get yourself a coffee when you're running late without screwing everything up.

If you can't stick to the budget, keep tweaking it until you find something actually livable and below your means. Then I would try to get the savings portion direct deposited into a savings account. Preferably something like ING that you don't have to see the money and be tempted into spending it. Make your pin # some crazy thing you'll never remember and hide it so you can just forget about the balance and let it grow.

Also, if your employer has a retirement plan with a match you should be participating in that. It's really great that you have been avoiding debt, it frees up a lot of money for other things, like saving. :) Good luck!
 
one thing has popped in my mind that might help you - on paydays I used to pay all bills and stuff first, the see how much have I left over, and then divide the sum for the rest of the month, so I always knew I had £xx to spend each day and no more. If I didnt spend as much one day - I could treat myself the next and so on. If you need to put something aside - then pay all necessities, decide how much you are putting aside, and then see how much you are left with for each day of the rest of the month.

And the way I look at it now is kind of non-materialistic, really, I live through the day not worrying about having anything to my name, being old or not. I simply came to the conclusion that I really dont NEED all these clothes, shoes, bags, etc. If I go out somewhere and feel tempted to buy something, I always think 9 times - do I really need it, how much do I need it, could I do without? So, I rarely buy anything, and if I do buy - I make sure that its gonna last, never buy cheap shite, cuz u end up paying twice in the end anyway. One thing I cant resist though is traveling :) I can go a loooong way without a lot of what most people consider necessities, just so I can get a break away from this depressing city. Even living below the poverty level like I do, I still manage to do that :D At the end of the day, my priorities are different from most people's, I'd rather sit in my chair old and poor, without anything to my name, but having a lot of good memories of how I lived my life :)

I go on breaks as well but they cost me a lot of money, I do not like really cheap hotels because I am obsessive about hygiene issues (few cheap hotels meet my hygiene standards) and I do like to go away for at least a few days at a time. I think what I am after is to be able to live a life with great experiences while I am young but also build and have a solid financial base for when I am old and cannot work any longer. Also, I need to save because a lot of the experiences I would like to have are going to be costly.

I was less concerned with stablity until when I saw my grandfather's experience towards the end of his life. I made a lot of conclusions about what happens when one has very little money and is old & vulnerable. I am pleased that you have have found freedom from a certain way of thinking, it must have ended a lot of fear and struggle in your mind to think the way you do.
 
I read somewhere that INFJ's are not good with money. I am decent with money and can pay my bills, shop thrifty, and still get things I want but saving isn't my gift. I was doing good until I had to spend it on a lawyer, tires, a battery, etc. I am needing the same advice but I think I need someone doing it for me! LOL


My main problems is with savings as well. I always pay my bills and so on but I feel like something in me is aiming to spend exactly all of what I earn. I think at least part of my problem is the little shadow ESTP hedonist who is always with me. Damn you Se.
 
I go on breaks as well but they cost me a lot of money, I do not like really cheap hotels because I am obsessive about hygiene issues (few cheap hotels meet my hygiene standards) and I do like to go away for at least a few days at a time. I think what I am after is to be able to live a life with great experiences while I am young but also build and have a solid financial base for when I am old and cannot work any longer. Also, I need to save because a lot of the experiences I would like to have are going to be costly.

I was less concerned with stablity until when I saw my grandfather's experience towards the end of his life. I made a lot of conclusions about what happens when one has very little money and is old & vulnerable. I am pleased that you have have found freedom from a certain way of thinking, it must have ended a lot of fear and struggle in your mind to think the way you do.

a bit off topic - I wouldnt bank on expensive hotels being most hygienic :p I have worked in a few hotels in various positions beginning with housekeeping and ending with mid-management, I have seen so much malpractice in the sense of hygiene, that whenever I have to stay in a hotel, I always rinse my mugs, glasses, cutlery, bath and check under the beds :) and Im NOT obsessive about hygiene issues :) I recently stayed at the Sheraton, btw - dust rolling on the floor in corners and under the beds, hsk not washing/replacing any dirty glasses, bedding not changed once, I stayed for 3 nights and even at Holiday Inn's the bedding is changed every other day.... so I would deffo say that small family-run hotels are really better.
 
I'm an INFJ who is very good with money usually. This last year there's been a lot of emotional unheavel, and with it a lot of extra spending, but I'm getting it under control.

KEEP TRACK OF WHAT YOU SPEND.

Sometimes when I struggle with money slipping through my fingers, for whatever the reason, I keep a little money diary and into it I enter every penny i've spent (on a daily basis) and what that money was spent on. At the end of the week I add it all up for a total.

I try and limit the amount I spend on food. (Example: I set myself a limit of 50 -60 euro a week) I do weekly shops as I find the more frequently I go to the supermarket I end up coming out with extra crapI didn't really need. Before I go to the super market I eat so I'm not shoppingo n an empty stomach and I also write out a list of all the things I will need for the week. (Do meal planning!!)

I try not to eat out or order out often. I plan my meals carefully so I won't be stuck for food and I don't overindulge when I'm out either. A great alternative to ordering out is to buy frozen pizzas etc!

I try to calculate out how much my bills will be each month and set that aside in advance to see how much of my weekly pay check is left over. I like to take a portion of that money and stick it into a savings account if I can. The savings account isn't as easy to access and the money is generally untouched unless I end up using some of it for smething like a vacation!
 
It sounds like you may need to deal with emotional issues around spending money and having or not having money. It's easy to see how you grandfather's experience may have left an impressionable impact on you. One of our basic needs as humans is to feel secure. I would encourage you to delve into the emotional bonds you have with money and finances as security, and also the emotional shopping habits you've described. If you are using shopping as a way to deal with your emotions, then it may be extremely difficult to stick to a budget because mainting such financial consistency is not flexible enough to adapt to the shifting and inconsistent nature of our emotions.

Second, as you're figuring out the emotional stuff, I would indeed make a budget. There is lots of information you can google about this, books you can consult, and generally people with whom you can connect with that know more than I can offer, but in general the information you want to consider as you're constructing your budget is:


  • How much money do I earn per pay period?
  • How much of that money do I want to save and how much am I willing to spend?
  • Subtract the latter from the former
  • How much are my monthly bills like rent, utilities, car/transportation payments (including insurance, gas, and maintenance), telephone, internet, cable, any other insurance payments, pet bills, groceries (including pet food), medical bills, dental bills, etc. -- These are the things in your life you're likely not able to eliminate. I mean, you could elimiate cable, internet, etc. or perhaps they are so essential to your daily functioning that they are not in fact compromisable. (Ex. some people say my cat is an added expense for me and having a very small income I might want to give her away, but she helps my mental health tremendously so I see her as an investment and am willing to keep that expense in my life. So she is really as non-compromiseable to me as something like rent.)
  • How much do you spend monthly on things that you can regulate: ex. eating out, buying clothes, going to the movies, renting dvd's, buying things just because you like them, socializing, etc. Then decide on a budget for these things. I.e. Items like rent are not flexible, but certain acts like eating out or buying clothes are more flexible. The idea (unless you are in dire need of saving money) is not to eliminate all of the flexible things, but to organize your spending so that you allow yourself to spend a certain amount on them (ex. $60 eating out monthly, or $100, or whatever works for you) and this will help you to not exceed that amount. Make sure this is flexible enough to not make you feel deprived, but set at a price that still helps you put a little bit away each month or to live within your means if that's what you desire.
  • What can also help is shopping on sale, especially things you need like toiletries, etc. Sometimes it's worth it to stock up when a great sale is on, and overtime this will contribute bit by bit.
  • In general, here are some categories to consider:
    • rent, utilities (heat, electricity, water, etc.)
    • home technology: phone, internet, cable
    • groceries
    • transportation (public or private -- car payments, car insurance, gas bills, scheduled maintenance over the year, supplies for inside the car like if you buy seat covers, things with which to clean the car, etc.)
    • personal care items: items required for personal hygiene
    • other household items: cleaning products, etc.
    • laundry (including laundry detergent, dryer sheets, weekly coins if you use a coin-operated washer/dryer, etc.)
    • pet expenses (pet food, pet insurance, pet shampoo, scheduled vet visits, pet toys, litter/poop bags, clothing, bedding, equipment, etc.)
    • And whatever other non-comrpomisable living expenses you have
    • recreation/socializing: what you spend when going out with other people
    • solo recreation: what you spend when going out by yourself
    • eating out
    • clothing: what is required (ex. you know you need to buy a new coat, new work shirts, etc.) vs. shopping as recreation because you enjoy it
    • healthcare bills -- insurance, medicine, glasses, dentist, acupuncture, gym fees, etc.
    • grooming: hairdresser, getting nails done, etc. (whatever applies)
    • personal development: are you interested in taking any courses in your free time?
    • etc.
  • Also good to consider how you will organize the monthly vs. weekly vs. annual nature of some expenses. Ex. rent tends to be monthly, groceries tend to be weekly, vet bills tend to be annual or twice a year. Breaking your financial and spending habits down and then figuring out a way to organize them is also key.
  • Sometimes it may help to open up a separate bank account depending on whether your bank charges fees and what kind of fees.
  • If you are trying to save, look for unnecessary spending in your habits. Ex. Are you paying more than you need to for monthly bank fees? Could you downgrade your plan or switch to another bank? Alternately, are you paying extra for bank fees because you exceed your monthly allowable transactions and would it save you money to upgrade your plan? How about your credit card -- does the card you have meet your needs? Are you spending more than you have to because of an annual fee or would having an annual fee decrease your overall charges? Where do you buy your groceries? Is this most cost-effective? How do you plan your grocery shopping? Do you throw out a lot of food each week/month? Could you save money on this? How much we can save depends on our existing habits -- if they are cost-efficient then we may find we're already saving as much as we can, but on the other hand there may be things we can change about our spending. Also, I think I already said this earlier, see if you can shop on sale. It really helps. :)
  • Are you subscribed to any points-saving programs? Where I live, I earn points at certain retailers and I've set it up so I don't pay annual fees. The points are slow to come, but they do add up overtime. This is helpful because you may actually be able to get things for spending money. It doesn't save a ton of money but it's a nice gift every now and then to earn enough points to use your points to get a grill, or a $50 restaurant card, or something like that, simply for spending the same money you always have.

This list may or may not apply to you, but it's meant to serve as an example. I personally don't organize my current budget by these categories. I basically have the things that are consistent each month and because they are consistent I don't track them, but I track everything else. I actually jot down each purchase, and keep track of it on Excel. Ex. I give myself $100 per week for things like groceries, medical bills, personal care, pet food, etc. and try to fit one-time expenses (like traveling to a nearby city for an event) as they arise -- but I am judicious about these extra and one-time expenses (if you find you have them regularly, then I would budget them). I find giving myself a $100 budget means I tailor my weekly expenses to this budget. Like, if I know I want to go to a movie later in the week and the movie costs $12, then I will make sure I don't spend anything more than $88 on everything that week so I can fit the movie in on Friday (my week's run from Monday (day 1 of budget) to Sunday (last day of that week's budget). I have a very small income right now (grad student) so I don't suggest you use my numbers or my approach, but as you hopefully can see there are a myriad of ways to structure this and organize yourself. The most important may be to keep every receipt and write it down each and every day. Use an app on your phone or the memo pad on your phone if it helps. Or send yourself a text message with the amount right after the purchase that you can later refer to if holding onto receipts isn't going to work. The key here is to brainstorm ideas that work for you and stick to them. Keeping a budget can become 2nd hand, and it can be empowering because if you have a budget that works for you, sticking to the budget can allow you to shop without feeling guilt or panic about your purchases, and instead can fill you with a sense of control and peace over your practices and spending habits, and can also result in saved monies.

Good luck.
 
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a bit off topic - I wouldnt bank on expensive hotels being most hygienic :p I have worked in a few hotels in various positions beginning with housekeeping and ending with mid-management, I have seen so much malpractice in the sense of hygiene, that whenever I have to stay in a hotel, I always rinse my mugs, glasses, cutlery, bath and check under the beds :) and Im NOT obsessive about hygiene issues :) I recently stayed at the Sheraton, btw - dust rolling on the floor in corners and under the beds, hsk not washing/replacing any dirty glasses, bedding not changed once, I stayed for 3 nights and even at Holiday Inn's the bedding is changed every other day.... so I would deffo say that small family-run hotels are really better.

One of my first jobs while in college was working at an hotel. I saw the cleaning staff do quite unhygenic things such as using the bath towels to clean the bathroom floor and the toilet above the water line, not changing the sheets between guests if the sheets looked clean, not cleaning the bath or shower area where people with possible foot and skin infections recently used and the list goes on. I carry my own towels and vast quantities of disinfecting wipes to even the more expensive or family run hotels now and I am not a cleaning obsessed nut job either, I wish more people knew what goes on in some of these places.
 
It sounds like you may need to deal with emotional issues around spending money and having or not having money. It's easy to see how you grandfather's experience may have left an impressionable impact on you. One of our basic needs as humans is to feel secure. I would encourage you to delve into the emotional bonds you have with money and finances as security, and also the emotional shopping habits you've described. If you are using shopping as a way to deal with your emotions, then it may be extremely difficult to stick to a budget because mainting such financial consistency is not flexible enough to adapt to the shifting and inconsistent nature of our emotions.

Good luck.

I think my grandfather's experience whilst being alarming was probably a good wake up call for me. I have almost never been more determine about overcoming an issue. Your post goes into a lot of details which is helpful for budgeting purposes and I have copied and printed it and I will read it again.

On, the question of emotions, I am currently working on experiencing emotions but not necessarily acting on them; this money management issue is one of the priority areas in which I will apply what I am learning about emotional regulation. I am actually now using specific, concrete practical problems to work on incorporating certain qualities into myself and this has really been helping my self discipline and personal development for the past few months with certain other issues. Whereas before this I was trying to develop certain personal traits in a sort of untested, unmeasurable, abstract vacuum. I am way more into acting in a particular way than following my feelings generally for a few months now when dealing with certain other issues. I am currently 'processing' my emotions around money management so that they do not interfere too much with the financial plans I am putting in place.

Thanks for putting so much time and thought into your post. In creating this topic, I did not expect to have gotten so many excellent ideas and suggestions.
 
In order to save you have to consistently live below your means. I've done this by figuring out how much I want to save, and then making a monthly budget that includes that savings. You do need to figure out where your money is going to make the budget. If you're spending $75 a week eating out, then you'll want to include some money for dining in your budget, but maybe you can make your own coffee and bring that down to $60 a week. One trick I learned (from a Dave Ramsey groupie) was to use cash for as many of your budgeted items (like eating out) as possible. It's easier to stay on budget that way because when the cash is gone, you know you have to eat at home for the rest of the week. Also, make sure to include some kind of general "spending money" category in your budget, even if its just $20 a week, so you can get yourself a coffee when you're running late without screwing everything up.

If you can't stick to the budget, keep tweaking it until you find something actually livable and below your means. Then I would try to get the savings portion direct deposited into a savings account. Preferably something like ING that you don't have to see the money and be tempted into spending it. Make your pin # some crazy thing you'll never remember and hide it so you can just forget about the balance and let it grow.

Also, if your employer has a retirement plan with a match you should be participating in that. It's really great that you have been avoiding debt, it frees up a lot of money for other things, like saving. Good luck!

I feel encouraged by your post and I think some tweaking may be involved before I settle on a budget that is fit for purpose. This week I have also started using cash for the more problematic expenses. So far I can say that it does seem to have focused my mind on the fact that I am actually spending money, whereas using a card does not seem so real. I do also like the general spending money category because I think it will make the next budget less rigid and compensate for the emotional spending stuff somewhat as well.
Thank you.