Minorities: Seek Benefits, Risk Resentment | INFJ Forum

Minorities: Seek Benefits, Risk Resentment

Flavus Aquila

Flavus Aquila

Finding My Place in the Sun
Banned
Mar 14, 2009
10,032
5,724
1,102
Australia
MBTI
INTJ - A
Enneagram
10000
Is it possible, that in trying to assist minorities, they are being exposed to the envy and resentment of others not similarly benefited?

...

It was a strategy of imperial powers in the past to privilege certain groups to create division and facilitate their rule. Eg. The artificial division of the Hutus and Tutsis in Rwanda.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Wyote
Just an observation, the scenario doesn't really question that the conditions of were set (imposed or manipulated) by an imperial power. As such, by default there remains to be an inequality of opportunity as you put it in another thread, which (correct me if I'm wrong) was an issue that it was the duty of the government to address in your opinion.

Aside from this, I'm not sure I'd place that responsibility upon the government. I'd assert that it's a cultural responsibility to preserve appreciation for (and ensure equal opportunity for) all. I'm ok with the firehouse being all one color based upon people's job skills, but not because the different person was passed over or ostracized for whatever qualities they possess that do not directly relate to their ability to perform the job.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Wyote
Sloe Djinn said:
Just an observation, the scenario doesn't really question that the conditions of were set (imposed or manipulated) by an imperial power. As such, by default there remains to be an inequality of opportunity as you put it in another thread, which (correct me if I'm wrong) was an issue that it was the duty of the government to address in your opinion.

Aside from this, I'm not sure I'd place that responsibility upon the government. I'd assert that it's a cultural responsibility to preserve appreciation for (and ensure equal opportunity for) all. I'm ok with the firehouse being all one color based upon people's job skills, but not because the different person was passed over or ostracized for whatever qualities they possess that do not directly relate to their ability to perform the job.
Click to expand...
Perhaps you could elaborate on the claim that there isn't equality of opportunity. I know that there's differences of circumstances, which means that some have to work harder and some less hard to get the same result.
 
Flavus Aquila said:
Perhaps you could elaborate on the claim that there isn't equality of opportunity. I know that there's differences of circumstances, which means that some have to work harder and some less hard to get the same result.
Click to expand...

In terms of the example, those populations are being manipulated specifically to create hatred. While I believe that it is possible that envy and resentment could arise, I guess I would just be hard-pressed to see this occurring in a way that would mirror an outcome such as a civil war. I mean, do you have any more moderate examples of where the cost outweighed the benefit, and the accommodation created such animosity that the situation of those who "benefited" was worse than it was before?
 
Sloe Djinn said:
In terms of the example, those populations are being manipulated specifically to create hatred. While I believe that it is possible that envy and resentment could arise, I guess I would just be hard-pressed to see this occurring in a way that would mirror an outcome such as a civil war. I mean, do you have any more moderate examples of where the cost outweighed the benefit, and the accommodation created such animosity that the situation of those who "benefited" was worse than it was before?
Click to expand...
Donald Trump is President. Many attribute his popularity to growing resentment among the middle class, that they have been excessively neglected and treated as inferior to every other demographic.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cvp12gh5
Flavus Aquila said:
Donald Trump is President. Many attribute his popularity to growing resentment among the middle class, that they have been excessively neglected and treated as inferior to every other demographic.
Click to expand...
Middle class is pretty broad. Which are the opposing minorities? I'm assuming that these will be non-middle class and not subsections? Additionally, are you exclusively talking about minority based on socioeconomic status, or is this blended with other factors of differentiation?
 
Sloe Djinn said:
Middle class is pretty broad. Which are the opposing minorities? I'm assuming that these will be non-middle class and not subsections? Additionally, are you exclusively talking about minority based on socioeconomic status, or is this blended with other factors of differentiation?
Click to expand...
I'm not arguing for that perception, just noting its existence at your request for a more hum drum example of artificial division created by the selective distribution of benefits (ie special benefits).
 
As an American o do not believe anyone should be provided with more than someone else. However we do have programs...good programs to help people. Often though, those programs are taken advantage of.
In short, if you want something more than your fellow country man receives there should be a good and acceptible explanation to go along with it before it's provided.
 
Flavus Aquila said:
I'm not arguing for that perception, just noting its existence at your request for a more hum drum example of artificial division created by the selective distribution of benefits (ie special benefits).
Click to expand...

Oh. Why illustrate with a perception that you wouldn't support?
 
Privileging certain groups insinuates giving opportunities to one group that wouldn't be afforded to another. However, whether or not that would create resentment when orchestrated by an imperial power (which has no intention of sharing its status, or allowing any of the minorities to have an "equal" status as opposed to "privileged", and which summarily seeks to allot this privilege specifically in order to pit those minorities against each other) is different than affording a minority an opportunity a leg up to be on equal footing with the majority.

Your example discusses a situation in which privilege is used specifically to create animosity in that it is also intended to deny that opportunity to someone else for the purpose of creating resentment. As such, I'm contending that if it's not targeted to cause minorities to hate each other, then it's not likely that whatever resultant envy or resentment arises will necessarily be harmful to those who benefited.

Why do you think I have an issue?
 
Flavus Aquila said:
Is it possible, that in trying to assist minorities, they are being exposed to the envy and resentment of others not similarly benefited?

...

It was a strategy of imperial powers in the past to privilege certain groups to create division and facilitate their rule. Eg. The artificial division of the Hutus and Tutsis in Rwanda.
Click to expand...

It is more than a possibility. It is what is happening in the U.S. And by "minority" I am referring to those of a lower socioeconomic status regardless of race.

I think the program started out with good intentions. They just failed at considering the long-term ramifications of such a program. I am all for welfare. I think we need to take care of the less fortunate. But as I mentioned before, the system is completely broken. There are people scamming the welfare system (the gov't makes it easy to do so but not intentionally), some are just unwilling to work because the would rather collect a check and do nothing, and then their are the people that really do want out of the system and they try to work towards that but they may be unaware of the services provided by the program due to staffing issues (poor training of welfare staff...they don't even know what the program offers).

Plus, if the gov't is using the money of the working class to pay for a broken system and they (w.c.) are the ones struggling to get by because they have to pay full price for everything while people with less get it for free (because it was paid for with THEIR hard earned money) then YES, it causes a huge amount of resentment and hatred. The system does not make sense and it needs to be fixed to work for everyone.

And when people get worked up over it, they do not sit down and rationally consider the problem and where it started. All they see and feel is that they are being taken advantage of. And they take all of that anger and hatred and direct it at an easy target: the poor. Clearly misguided hostility.

I didn't write all of my thoughts on this topic. But yeah. People need to stop hating each other and start working on solutions.

The problem is the system. Not the people.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Flavus Aquila
Flavus Aquila said:
Anyhow, you haven't made any progress on elaborating on the claim that there isn't equality of opportunity.
Click to expand...
It would be difficult to make that claim here in America with affirmative action giving more opportunity to some than others.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Flavus Aquila
There are cases like these.

Hell, you guys already have it. Just look at whenever the minimum labor wage issue is presented in ....EVERYWHERE.

See office workers immediately descended upon what they deemed as 'lesser' workers, claiming they just flip burgers / clean stuff / pick trashes / etc and does not deserve the increase in wages and they MUST SUFFER.

Because we suffer too.

Meanwhile those sitting up above were laughing, enjoying their luxuries, taking their Russian golden shower and eating pizzas off naked children's bodies.

But I found it weird that the focus and the blame lies on the system solely when people do discriminate based on other factors not named competence.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back