Killing freedom of speech | INFJ Forum

Killing freedom of speech

the13thmartian

the13thmartian

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Jul 22, 2012
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Greetings everyone! I'm from the Philippines and I swear, I swear I want to go and live on another planet right now. I swear if someone can get me to Mars, I will happily live there.

I really can't believe we have a government so stupid and incompetent (Yes, Gov't of the Phil. you can quote me on that and send me to prison for that). Anyway, starting tomorrow, Oct. 3, the Cybercrime Prevention Act will be enacted in the Phil. While I agree that identity theft, cyber sex and child pornography among others should really be illegal, several parts are vague and may lead to abuse. That is, we not only say goodbye to downloading and file-sharing but also to posting criticisms online. The provision is very unclear, it leaves a lot of room for misinterpretation and abuse. That is, liking and sharing something on facebook may already be grounds for libel. And the penalty for online libel is graver than published libel and also the other cyber crimes; if someone is found guilty he might want to enjoy up to 12 years imprisonment... Too bad, we can't bash on our incompetent President and our stupid legislators, and I'm telling you, there are A LOT in our country. Those corrupt and unfit officials are more than glad to use this as a shield for all the criticisms they get.
Also, there is the big issue on privacy. And underlying issue of FREEDOM. To think that we have a democratic government. I really want to go on a killing-spree right now.

Anyway, some Senators have already filed or will file bills to repeal the RA 10175. And we all do hope this will get repealed or the netizens will continue the black-out propaganda on facebook.

I just want to know what you guys think about the issue. And more importantly, your thoughts on freedom of speech and just how much power should the government exercise on its people.

Thanks! Here are the links: http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertc...evention-act-that-makes-sopa-look-reasonable/
http://www.gov.ph/2012/09/12/republic-act-no-10175/
 
Freedom :) These days you are only free to do as you are told/permitted. There's no such thing as freedom.
 
I just want to know what you guys think about the issue. And more importantly, your thoughts on freedom of speech and just how much power should the government exercise on its people.
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Greetings to you too! Thanks for sharing this, I was not aware this was going on and I find it very interesting.

So... basically, according to that law, which has been passed already, it is now considered libel to criticize the government in the Phillipines? At all?

And if you're found guilty, you get 12 years in prison?

That is extremely harsh, to put it mildly. Also, if such a law were passed here in the US, pretty much everybody would currently be in jail twice over, due to the amount of criticizing of the government and re-sharing of sarcastic political posts that goes on.

I hope the law gets repealed because freedom of speech is crucial. This seems to go far beyond protecting copyrights and things, doesn't it? (I couldn't get the link to the actual law to work, BTW.)

Edit: I was able to view the legal definition of "Libel" in the Phillipines, and if I understand it correctly, it includes "malicious statements", even if they are true.

....every defamatory imputation is presumed to be malicious, even if it be true; if no good intention and justifiable motive for making it is shown. There is malice when the author of the imputation is prompted by personal ill-will or spite and speaks not in response to duty but merely to injure the reputation of the person who claims to have been defamed. Truth then is not a defense, unless it is shown that the matter charged as libelous was made with good motives and for justifiable ends.
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I wonder what would constitute good motives and justifiable ends?

Yeah, scary. :/

Another edit: But freedom of speech is protected by the Phillipine constitution, is it not? This law must be unconstitutional.... right?

“No law shall be passed abridging the freedom of speech, of expression, or of the press, or the right of the people peaceably to assemble and petition the government for redress of grievances.”
Click to expand...
 
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Yeah, and we even call our country democratic.
 
this is only temporary said:
Greetings to you too! Thanks for sharing this, I was not aware this was going on and I find it very interesting.

So... basically, according to that law, which has been passed already, it is now considered libel to criticize the government in the Phillipines? At all?

And if you're found guilty, you get 12 years in prison?

That is extremely harsh, to put it mildly. Also, if such a law were passed here in the US, pretty much everybody would currently be in jail twice over, due to the amount of criticizing of the government and re-sharing of sarcastic political posts that goes on.

I hope the law gets repealed because freedom of speech is crucial. This seems to go far beyond protecting copyrights and things, doesn't it? (I couldn't get the link to the actual law to work, BTW.)

Edit: I was able to view the legal definition of "Libel" in the Phillipines, and if I understand it correctly, it includes "malicious statements", even if they are true.



I wonder what would constitute good motives and justifiable ends?

Yeah, scary. :/

Another edit: But freedom of speech is protected by the Phillipine constitution, is it not? This law must be unconstitutional.... right?
Click to expand...

Well, if you're caught doing it then it is a ground for libel. Not necessarily 12 years but it can amount to that.

Good point that I wasn't able tor raise. The law is against the Constitution with respect to that.

But one good thing here in our country, the government is shit when it comes to implementing laws. HAHAHA
 
this is only temporary said:
Greetings to you too! Thanks for sharing this, I was not aware this was going on and I find it very interesting.

So... basically, according to that law, which has been passed already, it is now considered libel to criticize the government in the Phillipines? At all?

And if you're found guilty, you get 12 years in prison?

That is extremely harsh, to put it mildly. Also, if such a law were passed here in the US, pretty much everybody would currently be in jail twice over, due to the amount of criticizing of the government and re-sharing of sarcastic political posts that goes on.

I hope the law gets repealed because freedom of speech is crucial. This seems to go far beyond protecting copyrights and things, doesn't it? (I couldn't get the link to the actual law to work, BTW.)

Edit: I was able to view the legal definition of "Libel" in the Phillipines, and if I understand it correctly, it includes "malicious statements", even if they are true.



I wonder what would constitute good motives and justifiable ends?

Yeah, scary. :/

Another edit: But freedom of speech is protected by the Phillipine constitution, is it not? This law must be unconstitutional.... right?
Click to expand...

Well, if you're caught doing it then it is a ground for libel. Not necessarily 12 years but it can amount to that.

Good point that I wasn't able tor raise. The law is against the Constitution with respect to that.

But one good thing here in our country, the government is shit when it comes to implementing laws. HAHAHA
 
the13thmartian said:
But one good thing here in our country, the government is shit when it comes to implementing laws. HAHAHA
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That is fortunate! Maybe you can make it even more challenging for anyone wanting to implement this particular law by staging a mass libel party in which as many people as possible simultaneously post snarky remarks about various government officials. Then watch them try to arrest everyone... :D
 
Funny because we really don't care and we're even more critical on social media because of this.
 
At least there's always the option of using a VPN.
 
Freedom of speech seems mostly psychological to me. If it's an immoral law just don't follow it. If they try to punish you for it then revolt.
 
The laws regarding cyber use and speech are extremely vague b/c it is only now that case precedence is being established. It is not much different irl than it is online; however we used to believe we were protected by our anonymity. If/when you do something out of line, you will be caught eventually. You are actually violating copyright laws when you copy/paste an entire news article. Whether the original author has the time or energy to find you is another story.

I'll tell you this...don't mess with Disney. :D
 
This is happening right across the neo-liberal empire. It is happening in the US and in Europe as well. There have been a number of laws aimed at greater controls over the internet such as: CISPA, ACTA, PIPA, SOPA and there is face recognition surveillance software now employed in the US and UK called trapwire. The UK government is trying to pass legislation that can let the government look at anything you do online

By 'neo-liberal empire' i mean the countries that are currently under the control of the USA and are adopting the US neo-liberal policies (the 'washington consensus')

The fiat currency system is collapsing and the elites of the neo-liberal empire are now very worried that the people might rise up like they have in the middle east. To control their own populations they are creating a surveillance state and will be trying to control more and more aspects of our lives

The next step in the USA is for the military industrial complex to try and take the guns of the american public off them because they know that people who have guns can stand up for themselves just like the founders of the USA did when they kicked out the British elites

There is a global clampdown going on and the internet is going to be one of the main targets. the internet is educating people too much and it is allowing people to trade outwith the usual channels and with currencies that the neo-liberal central banking system don't control such as bitcoin

It is very possible that if the corporatocracy/military industrial complex are not able to control the internet they will try and shut it down altogether

TOR is one way to encript what you do online and bitcoin offers a viable alternative to fiat currency
 
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The next step in the USA is for the military industrial complex to try and take the guns of the american public off them because they know that people who have guns can stand up for themselves just like the founders of the USA did when they kicked out the British elites
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That's a possibility which could only be entertained by someone who has never spent any time in Texas. Or 90% of the US.
 
muir said:
By 'neo-liberal empire' i mean the countries that are currently under the control of the USA and are adopting the US neo-liberal policies (the 'washington consensus')
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Why do you choose the term liberal as opposed to conservative, as opposed to any other label? I dont see why it is liberal to act in this way.
 
this is only temporary said:
That's a possibility which could only be entertained by someone who has never spent any time in Texas. Or 90% of the US.
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Below is a link to a clip of Catherine Austin Fitts supporting what i've said. Her interview begins at 13 mins but she really starts mentioning what i'm talking about at 17:50mins and specifically about the gun control issue at 21:10 mins

Clip: http://rt.com/programs/keiser-report/episode-337-max-keiser/

Here are her credentials from wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catherine_Austin_Fitts):

Fitts served as managing director and member of the board of directors of the Wall Street investment bank Dillon, Read & Co. Inc., as Assistant Secretary of Housing and Federal Housing[SUP][1][/SUP] Commissioner at the United States Department of Housing and Urban Development in the first Bush Administration, and was the president of Hamilton Securities Group, Inc., an investment bank and financial software developer.
Fitts has a BA from the University of Pennsylvania, an MBA from the Wharton School and studied Mandarin at the Chinese University of Hong Kong. She publishes a column, "Mapping the Real Deal," in Scoop in New Zealand.

Catherine Austin Fitts is the president of Solari, Inc., the publisher of The Solari Report, managing member of Solari Investment Advisory Services, LLC., and managing member of Sea Lane Advisory Services, LLC

I'm pretty sure Fitts has been to texas and many other states in the USA
 
UBERROGO said:
Why do you choose the term liberal as opposed to conservative, as opposed to any other label? I dont see why it is liberal to act in this way.
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I'm not choosing the term, it is the name given to a set of rules that certain countries are abiding by. The rules are policies which move wealth from the people to the top 1% of the top 1%

The term 'liberal' as used in this context is referring to a modern version of classical liberalism. This modern version is called 'neo-classical liberalism' or 'neo-liberalism'

You can research into neoliberalism if you want and i'd recommend you do but be wary of who you are listening to because if you get an apologist for the elite they will tell you that it is the word of god. However if you speak to poor people around the world they will tell you that what neo-liberalism means is the movement of wealth from the 99% to the 1%

All the economic turmoil currently happening around the world and all the social unrest....that is largely the result of neoliberalism
 
If anyone is concerned over the increasing government controls over the internet and sick of voting for the two usual political parties who are clearly both working for the military industrial complex and are hiding this behind a facade of political theatre then consider voting for the pirate party; here's some info about them on wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pirate_Party
 
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