INFJ female in relationship with a very complicated INFJ male | INFJ Forum

INFJ female in relationship with a very complicated INFJ male

kri

kri

Lucky
Aug 27, 2013
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INFJ
This is the first time I post here, I need to rant out some of the tension and emotions that I have.

I have been in a 1 year relationship with a complicated INFJ male who is 4 years older than me in his thirties. He is an artist/designer/musician/intellectual and he used to be my teacher in art college, we have so many things in common and we have know each other for years, working together on several projects, always been drawn to each other but both have been afraid to actually act upon those impulses until last year when he had ended a very compliacted relationship (most of his relationships have been very complicated )and he started casually interacting with me like a friend and every time getting closer until I (we)realized that there is much more that we need from each other - so basically he made the first moves and I reciprocated and it was magic, perfect! So we were in 7th heaven for few months, for me it is very hard to open up at first and start trusting so I was quite afraid and as I realized later that he felt the same but still did enormous steps(for INFJ corageous) to actually become closer to me. But now I feel we have serious communication problems and the closensess disappeared after a few months into the relationship, I realized that we actually started mirroring each other insecurities and fears and amplyfying them, in the end he became very distant all of a sudden and I didnt understand what happened and I distanced myself even more. Still trying to communicate the situation, that didnt work, he did a few passive agressive stunts which worked like magic on me, making me run to him and tell him that i will not disappear and I am here to stay and I want to be with him. He has had this unexplainable belief from the beginning that I will walk out on him and I will disappear and that i do not want this relationship as much as he does, I tried to tell him that I am still warming up and that he has to give me time, I want this more than anything. Still his body language changed, he wanted to see how much I care for him, so he stopped making first moves, I had to show him that i want to be with him, he would not call me anymore or ask me to come to his place, he wanted me to do these thing impulsively, to come when I want not that when he wants just to see how much i want - now I basically live with him, although I rent my apartment. He would not touch me anymore or hug me or kiss me casually(before he was so romantic and intimately close), I have to start approaching him, the distance has grown, sometimes he even turns his head when I try to kiss him, like it is somekind of an obligation, actually he wont kiss me casually, maybe occasionaly hug etc. (rarely) so every time i want closeness I have to go and *ask him* and hope that he will reciprocate if it is convenient- as he told me the one that is thirsty has the legs, right now I am not sure he has legs even when he is thirsty. So the worse thing is that I love him so much and try to communicate things that need to be said or even very casual things how are you doing what are you thinking what is happening with me /you etc, just to avoid the situtation (where we have been many times) where we both imagine some things in our heads about each other and presume that it must be true - which in the end turns out to be a big mess and again mirroring each other insecurities. But every time I try to start talking he turns into this growling little animal in the corner, gets very defencive and starts barking out hurtful things, with no reason whatsoever, I have swallowed quite a few hurtful things - he has never apologized although i know that he knows that it was out of line. Or the other reaction is a complete blanking and silent treatment, he has very strong passive agressive tendencies - I have never seen anything like that before, he will not admit to anything, he turned his back and walked out of the room when I told him gently - darling I sometimes feel that I dont know how to be around you, sometimes I feel you want space and sometimes not but I would aprecciate if you tell me these things, because then i can take it into consideration and little things will not escalate and I will understand if you want your space just sometimes I am not sure when and It would be helpful if you could just tell me...he just turned his back and walked out of the room..later he said that I am the most introvert and it is hard to be with someone so cold as I am and that it is unfair to expect when I want to talk that he has to be ready for this kind of avalanche of accusations. I felt really bad and told him that accusing him is the last thing i want to do, I just tried to communicate what was going inside me but he was not ready to listen...he never is, only when he has a problem we can talk about things(te routine is that he disappears, passive agressive, does not answer phone, then reappears and wants to talk to me, expecting me to be happy and ready to be there when he needs), but when I feel sad or need support he walks out, he cannot handle me being sad (whatever the reason) he just leaves the room and distances. At the same time he says that i am not communicating enough and that i am distant and that he feels distance because of that - that makes me so sad and I cannot even say that to him. He actually broke up with me in spring after I had stayed out with friends too long, he was supposed to come too but stood me up and I sent him a message that It will take a bit longer tonight, when I came home, he had disappeared and didnt answer his phone, he returned the next day to tell me that this is not working and that he feels I do not want to be with him and I am searching for attention from outside and he feels hurt that apparently he is not the one that can feed my attention needs - that came out of the blue - I was shocked and hurt, he has always been afraid that i will leave and I feel he has made up his mind that i will leave and he needs to prove himself right - my friends tell me he is a passive agressive dick and what he does is emotional violence and that i am being manipulated and that he unknowingly sabotages the relationship with his behaviour. I told him that I love him and that we are quite similar in many things and we work together well and understand each other and we can help each other but we have to be ready to communicate things, even things that are hard. He pondered about this for a while and a month later he took me back (or he came back) but still ther is this wall he has set up and he is not willing to meet me in the middle, i try to talk about things, I kiss and hug him and give him space and give him intimacy - he takes and takes and takes but I am not sure anymore how much he is willing to give again the way he was giving when we first started our relationship, I feel he takes me for granted and I love him still and I want to help him, i know the intimacy level that he craves but he is systematically shutting himself out of it...he hates when I distance myself from him (even when he pushes me away) and then he gets frustrated when i come close even though he hates when I distance myself...I know he needs me but he doesnt know what to do about this feeling, i feel I am constantly being tested and I feel like am walking on eggshells most of the time, he is emotionally quite unstaible althoug he is always very calm I can feel his emotional rollecoaster, he cannot hide it. At the same time he needs me to be around as the only person he communicates with about his work and other things (he is quite a lonely type), he loves when i take care of him, loves when we go out together walking or hiking, I know that this wall and distance that he has built up is a facade, there is more of him somewhere there and I can feel through it but it is so hard, since I dont know where i stand - One day I gathered my courage and asked him, how do you feel when you are with me, when we are together - he said i do not understand your question...and thats is all I know. I am there for him ..and even not there for him if he doesnt want that, I am genuinly in love but I feel so alone in this at the moment and what do I do, i cannot tell that to him, I come here and post it in the forum. Wow I have never felt anything so intense. We do have good days and this weekend we had a wonderful time but at the same time I am mesmerized by the mystery and the requirement for me to read his mind (I really feel that since for him it is so hard to say things out loud, he actually expects me to read his mind), sometimes I am not myself anymore. I know there is a key - I feel and know him better than he realises and he tests me. I know that what was in the beggining (is under the surface) has not gone anywhere...it is not possible.


http://youtu.be/7r3OgmPN4Ic
 
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[MENTION=9507]kri[/MENTION]'s original post that should have been here (yet somehow disappeared making me the 'thread owner' incorrectly) :

I am an INFJ female and have been in a 1 year relationship with a complicated INFJ male who is 4 years older than me in his thirties. He is an artist/designer/musician/intellectual and he used to be my teacher in art college, we have so many things in common and we have know each other for years, working together on several projects, always been drawn to each other but both have been afraid to actually act upon those impulses until last year when he had ended a very complicated relationship (most of his relationships have been very complicated )and he started casually interacting with me like a friend and every time getting closer until I (we)realized that there is much more that we need from each other - so basically he made the first moves and I reciprocated and it was magic, perfect! So we were in 7th heaven for few months, for me it is very hard to open up at first and start trusting so I was quite afraid and as I realized later that he felt the same but still did enormous steps(for INFJ courageous) to actually become closer to me.
But now I feel we have serious communication problems and the closeness disappeared after a few months into the relationship, I realized that we actually started mirroring each other insecurities and fears and amplifying them, in the end he became very distant all of a sudden and I didn't understand what happened and I distanced myself even more. Still trying to communicate the situation, that didn't work, he did a few passive aggressive stunts which worked like magic on me, making me run to him and tell him that i will not disappear and I am here to stay and I want to be with him.

He has had this unexplainable belief from the beginning that I will walk out on him and I will disappear and that i do not want this relationship as much as he does, I tried to tell him that I am still warming up and that he has to give me time, I want this more than anything. Still his body language changed, he wanted to see how much I care for him, so he stopped making first moves, I had to show him that i want to be with him, he would not call me anymore or ask me to come to his place, he wanted me to do these thing impulsively, to come when I want not that when he wants just to see how much i want - now I basically live with him, although I rent my apartment.

He would not touch me anymore or hug me or kiss me casually(before he was so romantic and intimately close), I have to start approaching him, the distance has grown, sometimes he even turns his head when I try to kiss him, like it is some kind of an obligation, actually he wont kiss me casually, maybe occasionally hug etc. (rarely) so every time i want closeness I have to go and *ask him* and hope that he will reciprocate if it is convenient- as he told me the one that is thirsty has the legs, right now I am not sure he has legs even when he is thirsty.

So the worse thing is that I love him so much and try to communicate things that need to be said or even very casual things how are you doing what are you thinking what is happening with me /you etc, just to avoid the situation (where we have been many times) where we both imagine some things in our heads about each other and presume that it must be true - which in the end turns out to be a big mess and again mirroring each other insecurities. But every time I try to start talking he turns into this growling little animal in the corner, gets very offensive and starts barking out hurtful things, with no reason whatsoever, I have swallowed quite a few hurtful things - he has never apologized although i know that he knows that it was out of line. Or the other reaction is a complete blanking and silent treatment, he has very strong passive aggressive tendencies - I have never seen anything like that before, he will not admit to anything, he turned his back and walked out of the room when I told him gently - darling I sometimes feel that I don't know how to be around you, sometimes I feel you want space and sometimes not but I would appreciate if you tell me these things, because then i can take it into consideration and little things will not escalate and I will understand if you want your space just sometimes I am not sure when and It would be helpful if you could just tell me...he just turned his back and walked out of the room..later he said that I am the most introvert and it is hard to be with someone so cold as I am and that it is unfair to expect when I want to talk that he has to be ready for this kind of avalanche of accusations. I felt really bad and told him that accusing him is the last thing i want to do, I just tried to communicate what was going inside me but he was not ready to listen...he never is, only when he has a problem we can talk about things(he routine is that he disappears, passive aggressive, does not answer phone, then reappears and wants to talk to me, expecting me to be happy and ready to be there when he needs), but when I feel sad or need support he walks out, he cannot handle me being sad (whatever the reason) he just leaves the room and distances.

At the same time he says that i am not communicating enough and that i am distant and that he feels distance because of that - that makes me so sad and I cannot even say that to him. He actually broke up with me in spring after I had stayed out with friends too long, he was supposed to come too but stood me up and I sent him a message that It will take a bit longer tonight, when I came home, he had disappeared and didn't answer his phone, he returned the next day to tell me that this is not working and that he feels I do not want to be with him and I am searching for attention from outside and he feels hurt that apparently he is not the one that can feed my attention needs - that came out of the blue - I was shocked and hurt, he has always been afraid that i will leave and I feel he has made up his mind that i will leave and he needs to prove himself right - my friends tell me he is a passive aggressive dick and what he does is emotional violence and that i am being manipulated and that he unknowingly sabotages the relationship with his behaviour. I told him that I love him and that we are quite similar in many things and we work together well and understand each other and we can help each other but we have to be ready to communicate things, even things that are hard. He pondered about this for a while and a month later he took me back (or he came back) but still ther is this wall he has set up and he is not willing to meet me in the middle, i try to talk about things, I kiss and hug him and give him space and give him intimacy - he takes and takes and takes but I am not sure anymore how much he is willing to give again the way he was giving when we first started our relationship, I feel he takes me for granted and I love him still and I want to help him, i know the intimacy level that he craves but he is systematically shutting himself out of it...he hates when I distance myself from him (even when he pushes me away) and then he gets frustrated when i come close even though he hates when I distance myself...I know he needs me but he doesn't know what to do about this feeling, i feel I am constantly being tested and I feel like am walking on eggshells most of the time, he is emotionally quite unstable although he is always very calm I can feel his emotional roller coaster, he cannot hide it. At the same time he needs me to be around as the only person he communicates with about his work and other things (he is quite a lonely type), he loves when i take care of him, loves when we go out together walking or hiking, I know that this wall and distance that he has built up is a facade, there is more of him somewhere there and I can feel through it but it is so hard, since I don't know where i stand - One day I gathered my courage and asked him, how do you feel when you are with me, when we are together - he said i do not understand your question...and thats is all I know.

I am there for him ..and even not there for him if he doesn't want that, I am genuinely in love but I feel so alone in this at the moment and what do I do, i cannot tell that to him, I come here and post it in the forum. Wow I have never felt anything so intense. We do have good days and this weekend we had a wonderful time but at the same time I am mesmerized by the mystery and the requirement for me to read his mind (I really feel that since for him it is so hard to say things out loud, he actually expects me to read his mind), sometimes I am not myself anymore. I know there is a key - I feel and know him better than he realises and he tests me. I know that what was in the beginning (is under the surface) has not gone anywhere...it is
 
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No, no faulty thread post 'Started by kri, 02-09-13 12:30 PM'... yet somehow I was able to 'add content' instead of reporting issue :(
 
I do not understand, none of my posts show, getting frustrated here.
 
I tried to copy paste the story again and it wont show

I am an INFJ female and have been in a 1 year relationship with a complicated INFJ male who is 4 years older than me in his thirties. He is an artist/designer/musician/intellectual and he used to be my teacher in art college, we have so many things in common and we have know each other for years, working together on several projects, always been drawn to each other but both have been afraid to actually act upon those impulses until last year when he had ended a very compliacted relationship (most of his relationships have been very complicated )and he started casually interacting with me like a friend and every time getting closer until I (we)realized that there is much more that we need from each other - so basically he made the first moves and I reciprocated and it was magic, perfect! So we were in 7th heaven for few months, for me it is very hard to open up at first and start trusting so I was quite afraid and as I realized later that he felt the same but still did enormous steps(for INFJ corageous) to actually become closer to me. But now I feel we have serious communication problems and the closensess disappeared after a few months into the relationship, I realized that we actually started mirroring each other insecurities and fears and amplyfying them, in the end he became very distant all of a sudden and I didnt understand what happened and I distanced myself even more. Still trying to communicate the situation, that didnt work, he did a few passive agressive stunts which worked like magic on me, making me run to him and tell him that i will not disappear and I am here to stay and I want to be with him. He has had this unexplainable belief from the beginning that I will walk out on him and I will disappear and that i do not want this relationship as much as he does, I tried to tell him that I am still warming up and that he has to give me time, I want this more than anything. Still his body language changed, he wanted to see how much I care for him, so he stopped making first moves, I had to show him that i want to be with him, he would not call me anymore or ask me to come to his place, he wanted me to do these thing impulsively, to come when I want not that when he wants just to see how much i want - now I basically live with him, although I rent my apartment. He would not touch me anymore or hug me or kiss me casually(before he was so romantic and intimately close), I have to start approaching him, the distance has grown, sometimes he even turns his head when I try to kiss him, like it is somekind of an obligation, actually he wont kiss me casually, maybe occasionaly hug etc. (rarely) so every time i want closeness I have to go and *ask him* and hope that he will reciprocate if it is convenient- as he told me the one that is thirsty has the legs, right now I am not sure he has legs even when he is thirsty. So the worse thing is that I love him so much and try to communicate things that need to be said or even very casual things how are you doing what are you thinking what is happening with me /you etc, just to avoid the situtation (where we have been many times) where we both imagine some things in our heads about each other and presume that it must be true - which in the end turns out to be a big mess and again mirroring each other insecurities. But every time I try to start talking he turns into this growling little animal in the corner, gets very defencive and starts barking out hurtful things, with no reason whatsoever, I have swallowed quite a few hurtful things - he has never apologized although i know that he knows that it was out of line. Or the other reaction is a complete blanking and silent treatment, he has very strong passive agressive tendencies - I have never seen anything like that before, he will not admit to anything, he turned his back and walked out of the room when I told him gently - darling I sometimes feel that I dont know how to be around you, sometimes I feel you want space and sometimes not but I would aprecciate if you tell me these things, because then i can take it into consideration and little things will not escalate and I will understand if you want your space just sometimes I am not sure when and It would be helpful if you could just tell me...he just turned his back and walked out of the room..later he said that I am the most introvert and it is hard to be with someone so cold as I am and that it is unfair to expect when I want to talk that he has to be ready for this kind of avalanche of accusations. I felt really bad and told him that accusing him is the last thing i want to do, I just tried to communicate what was going inside me but he was not ready to listen...he never is, only when he has a problem we can talk about things(te routine is that he disappears, passive agressive, does not answer phone, then reappears and wants to talk to me, expecting me to be happy and ready to be there when he needs), but when I feel sad or need support he walks out, he cannot handle me being sad (whatever the reason) he just leaves the room and distances. At the same time he says that i am not communicating enough and that i am distant and that he feels distance because of that - that makes me so sad and I cannot even say that to him. He actually broke up with me in spring after I had stayed out with friends too long, he was supposed to come too but stood me up and I sent him a message that It will take a bit longer tonight, when I came home, he had disappeared and didnt answer his phone, he returned the next day to tell me that this is not working and that he feels I do not want to be with him and I am searching for attention from outside and he feels hurt that apparently he is not the one that can feed my attention needs - that came out of the blue - I was shocked and hurt, he has always been afraid that i will leave and I feel he has made up his mind that i will leave and he needs to prove himself right - my friends tell me he is a passive agressive dick and what he does is emotional violence and that i am being manipulated and that he unknowingly sabotages the relationship with his behaviour. I told him that I love him and that we are quite similar in many things and we work together well and understand each other and we can help each other but we have to be ready to communicate things, even things that are hard. He pondered about this for a while and a month later he took me back (or he came back) but still ther is this wall he has set up and he is not willing to meet me in the middle, i try to talk about things, I kiss and hug him and give him space and give him intimacy - he takes and takes and takes but I am not sure anymore how much he is willing to give again the way he was giving when we first started our relationship, I feel he takes me for granted and I love him still and I want to help him, i know the intimacy level that he craves but he is systematically shutting himself out of it...he hates when I distance myself from him (even when he pushes me away) and then he gets frustrated when i come close even though he hates when I distance myself...I know he needs me but he doesnt know what to do about this feeling, i feel I am constantly being tested and I feel like am walking on eggshells most of the time, he is emotionally quite unstaible althoug he is always very calm I can feel his emotional rollecoaster, he cannot hide it. At the same time he needs me to be around as the only person he communicates with about his work and other things (he is quite a lonely type), he loves when i take care of him, loves when we go out together walking or hiking, I know that this wall and distance that he has built up is a facade, there is more of him somewhere there and I can feel through it but it is so hard, since I dont know where i stand - One day I gathered my courage and asked him, how do you feel when you are with me, when we are together - he said i do not understand your question...and thats is all I know. I am there for him ..and even not there for him if he doesnt want that, I am genuinly in love but I feel so alone in this at the moment and what do I do, i cannot tell that to him, I come here and post it in the forum. Wow I have never felt anything so intense. We do have good days and this weekend we had a wonderful time but at the same time I am mesmerized by the mystery and the requirement for me to read his mind (I really feel that since for him it is so hard to say things out loud, he actually expects me to read his mind), sometimes I am not myself anymore. I know there is a key - I feel and know him better than he realises and he tests me. I know that what was in the beginning (is under the surface) has not gone anywhere...it is not possible.
 
ok now it shows, some weird technical issues, sry everybody
 
so...you enjoy the back and forth complicated power trip, abandonment issues type of relationship and you want to know if you should stay or go?...not sure if this has an infj aspect to it; EXCEPT If you are an INFJ female then you know being with an INFJ male is like being in a relationship with yourself and everything will depend on how much you have yourself figured out as an INFJ...just saying
 
No I do not enjoy, I feel very sad and I am very much in love and hoping to be loved back but I only feel hurt, I cannot go either, i do not understand what is holding me, I don't know what to do. Tonight he turned his back when I stroked him and I asked that did I bother you or something, he said, it is late got to go to sleep, he turns his back and starts watching a movie alone from his ipad. I felt very hurt and asked that what is going on, what did I do, can't we watch together, he said why can't i just do my thing why do you have to be all around here bothering me, this cut me deep, very deep, I am sitting alone in the other room right now typing here and crying. I do not recognize myself anymore, I would never ever act like this with anybody, i have figured out about myself that this is the first time I have been so deeply in love and so full of hope and this is the first time I do not want to move forward and give up like I have done before, this is the first time I am able to be so calm and understanding but right now i think i am broken, I am not as tough as i want to be and this is cruel, and I cannot believe that someone could be cruel like this. Being in the relationship with myself yes well, maybe he needs to see how much he is not contributing at the moment (he should see how it is to be in a relationship with him), but hey that's just what he has alway expected, me to walk away, he does everything to accomplish that, and I am just suffocating from the pain I feel....the coldness is so cruel, he doesn't care that I am hurt at the moment...So now I am trying to pick up my pieces again and stay calm and tough and keep on going...I do not know what I am looking from here( in this forum) and I do not know how to cope with that passive agressive behaviour he is doing all the time.
 
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kri said:
No I do not enjoy, I feel very sad and I am very much in love and hoping to be loved back but I only feel hurt, I cannot go either, i do not understand what is holding me, I don't know what to do.
Click to expand...

Move on, seems you are trying to convince yourself he cares and loves you... afraid not (people cannot love others when they refuse to see past their own needs or mental health issues), sadly we cannot heal people too emotionally scarred to accept or share unconditional love, as you note in your 2 page essay* detailing how the last train to Lovesville has left you behind with a pathologically unhealthy individual.

*Recommends Real Love by Greg Baer as a wake up call book on what relationships should offer....*

*reformatted and put back where it should be at the top, making it easier for your copy-re-paste to be deleted or signposted to the top now :)
 
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How is your life?
Focus on your life first.

If anyone can take down an INFJ's wall, it's the INFJ themselves. Even if you are also an INFJ, the contribution of self-determination is very much important.
In fact because you admit you're also an INFJ, and assuming you're right; there is a high chance that you're seeing shadows of you-- and vice versa in his case.

a.k.a, assuming a lot of his actions and his inner workings are similar / shaped in the same pattern as you, even when it may be not the case.

I don't know whether this relationship is salvageable-- but I guess we can hope;

My advice? Talk to him, explain how do you see this relationship; how do you see his actions. Explain the way you think and feel. (if you're both an introvert, I suggest writing)
Tell him that if he wants to talk-- you're there, but otherwise it is his imperative to not talk and deal with his issues. Let him make his own decision-- whether to take it or leave it (because if anything, pushing them will only result in a higher wall)

And then live your life well-- get yourself in a top mental shape; take care of him if he wants to and/or if you have the power; don't push yourself and don't make him feel pushed.
 
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