Grammar and Intelligence | INFJ Forum

Grammar and Intelligence

Discussion in 'Psychology and MBTI' started by InTheWomblikeCocoon, Nov 20, 2009.

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  1. InTheWomblikeCocoon

    InTheWomblikeCocoon Community Member

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    Is there a correlation? Can anyone here honestly say that proper use of grammar is indicative (either in part or completely) of the level of intelligence (or g, I know that intelligence is a broad term so I will limit the definition of it to a combination of the ability to learn relatively quickly, detect patterns, and solve relatively difficult problems, which are NOT limited to subject matter; i.e.not only math problems).
    I am not talking about savantism, or genius, but g, the general intelligence factor.


     
  2. Moxie

    Moxie Absent-Minded Professor

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    I don't think so. I think good grammar just means that you have reasonable verbal intelligence. I've known some wickedly smart people that can't put a sentence together.
     
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  3. myst

    myst Community Member

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    I don't know if there's even a generalizable "ability to learn relatively quickly, detect patterns, and solve relatively difficult problems." I'd say ability to use proper grammar isn't indicative of much other than ability to use proper grammar
     
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    #3 myst, Nov 20, 2009
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  4. IndigoSensor

    IndigoSensor Product Obtained
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    I am going to say no, there is almost no corralation to it what so ever. I am not trying to toot my own horn here, but I know that I am a pretty smart person, yet I suck royally at grammar, as you might have noticed with my postings.
     
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  5. sassafras

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    Er, a good grasp of grammar and spelling can certainly make you appear intelligent, especially with the advent of text-speak on the internet, but it would be a sad day if it were a partial indicator of intellectual capability. I've known some bozos who can really write but are atrociously... daft.

    Then there are folks who write like D grade elementary schoolers... and also happen to be some of the sharpest minds I've ever met.
     
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  6. randomsomeone

    randomsomeone Well-known member

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    I hope not. I am off-the-scale visual....I do not think in words, but in pictures. More often than not I have to fumble for words simply to describe what I see. I mean, I survive...but I just think there are different types of intelligence and grammar may of may not factor into these in the same way.
     
  7. youhemmein

    youhemmein awkward turtle
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    I feel that proper use of grammar, spelling, and punctuation are indicative of the ability to recall stored information. This is less likely an indicator of general intelligence than it is a type of intelligence of its own merit.
     
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  8. Kavalan

    Kavalan Has risen

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    hmm definitely don't see a direct connection as it comes down to desire, which for me wasn't with grammar and such. Math and science were my thing and science still is.
     
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  9. Reon

    Reon Midnight's Garden

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    It makes you appear intelligent, you can be a genius but if you can't explain an idea you are usually useless. Grammar revolves around being able to work work within a system. (I really wanted to bring up the whole 'What is smart' thing, but I'm not. I'll be a good boy for now)
     
  10. OP
    InTheWomblikeCocoon

    InTheWomblikeCocoon Community Member

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    Well general intelligence encompasses all of those things mentioned, at least in part. I do agree that grammar is a type of intelligence, but I was wondering if it could indicate general intelligence (the flawed concept of the popular view of intelligence). i hope no one thought i was trying to be politically correct, because IQ and all that hype is really just an aspect of popular psychology and is not very credible in the eyes of more serious psychologists and psychiatrists. So, let me restate this "as g is defined as general intelligence-the ability to learn relatively quickly; meaning in comparison to a majority of the population, ability to detect patterns, which we can all do, but on a spectrum would be specified as an extreme in significantly intelligent individuals. I recognize how easy it is to confuse correlation and causation...and though some of you have stated that you knew a couple of individuals who contradicted the statement (which in my opinion is true, that grammar and intelligence are positively correlated) I wonder if a group of 100 individuals who were exceptionally skilled in language, and one group of 100 individuals who were linguistically challenged (assuming they all speak the same language) and who were put in the same room with one another show a wide range of intelligence scores given any basic intelligence test (for g).
    Which group do you believe would score higher?
     
  11. OP
    InTheWomblikeCocoon

    InTheWomblikeCocoon Community Member

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    Remember, although there are stipulations, language is a system, speech is a pattern
     
  12. Raccoon Love

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    As individuals we all have different kinds of intelligence, so no, grammar might have a correlation with verbal intelligence but there's almost no correlation with overall intelligence.
     
  13. gloomy-optimist

    gloomy-optimist Used to live here

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    It is indicative to a certain form of intelligence -- verbal, language, grammatical, etc. uses a certain type of learning and many mental functions.

    However, it does not correlate directly with overall intelligence. The ability to write is learned, and if one is not taught, they are not as apt in that area. Also, some people just don't really give a shit about how their grammar is -- they are much more concerned with getting their point across.

    Someone who cannot read or write may still be able to understand very complex ideas. But it takes a certain amount of intelligence to be very good at language.
     
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  14. OP
    InTheWomblikeCocoon

    InTheWomblikeCocoon Community Member

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    Not "giving a shit" about grammar and language has nothing to do with ability to utilize it, which is what many of you do not seem to be grasping...
     
  15. gloomy-optimist

    gloomy-optimist Used to live here

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    Well, the question of whether or not someone can utilize grammar and whether or not they do are two different questions. It's not uncommon for it to be a question of the latter.
     
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  16. Quinlan

    Quinlan Right the First Time!

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    I think there is a correlation between grammar and neurotic pedantry.
     
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  17. midnightmelody

    midnightmelody nagging for truth

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    Not always.
    I think that in many cases, it is more of a function of how much people actually care about that. Also, there are plenty of people that have a natural intelligence that did not have access to a proper education.
     
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  18. randomsomeone

    randomsomeone Well-known member

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    I have a huge respect for people like this.
     
  19. NaeturVindur

    NaeturVindur Cuddlemaster
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    Grammar and the use of it is innate to human beings. Every living person uses grammar with perfection. Talk to a linguist or anthropologist, and they'll tell you that everyone the THE expert in their variety of LANGUAGE (capitalization is important, and different from Language. LANGUAGE=the innate ability to communicate, Language=A language).

    The use of formalized grammar rules, however, could be a predictor of g (if you even feel that the idea of g is valid, which many many psychologists do not). Formal grammar is immensely complex, and not natural (almost by definition). therefore, the ability to keep track, and use all of these rules takes a high degree of mental ability. However, this is not a perfect predictor of g, as g entails a great deal more than verbal intelligence. One might be incredibly socially intelligent, but not be able to keep track of the plethora of rules involved in formal language.

    well, why don'chya look at dat, I done ram tagetha' idiers from two wholly diff'rent classes!
     
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  20. midnightmelody

    midnightmelody nagging for truth

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    Hmm, I would say I agree whole-heartedly, but when I really analyze it, I will not greatly credit someone for an ability they were born with, but rather their finely tuned skill to use this for the benfit of mankind, or in a way that is ...

    hmm I don't want to say suitable because someone will just ask me what I mean by that, and for now, I'm not sure.

    I guess I just don't like people who are intelligent and do things that are in my opnion, unethical or downright cruel, just because they are more intelligent and can get away with it.
     
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