Why is God unhappy with Cain's offering, and why is he happy with Abel's offering?
What does the last part mean, about "his desire" and "rule over him" - is "him" referring to a sort of personification of sin?
GENESIS 4:3-7 (God's response to Cain's offering)
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Why is God unhappy with Cain's offering, and why is he happy with Abel's offering?
What does the last part mean, about "his desire" and "rule over him" - is "him" referring to a sort of personification of sin?
I think it may have to do with their hearts/spirits. My impression from those verses is that Abel was humble and kind. Sounds like Abel gave the best of what he had to offer completely with a pure heart. Being that God is God, He likely also saw the coming resentment in Cain's heart towards his brother. I think God's point is that if your heart is not in the right place, then the offering has little worth or value. God is not about surfaces but the spirit. Because he knew where Cain's mind and heart was headed, yeah he is personifying sin implying that Cain will be a slave to sin if he continues on the path he is going. So, I think these verses are about God trying to warn Cain about the consequences of his thoughts and actions, and of course Cain didn't like that. I know its weird to use this analogy but it's like Anakin Skywalker in Star Wars who was warned about moving towards the dark side but ignored the warning and then became an ultimate evil in Darth Vader. The implication is that Anakin didn't have to become Darth Vader. Rather, he allowed himself to succumb to the temptation of the dark side and then chose that path. He could have chosen to go the other way. Back to the verse, I think this is why God said "If thou doest well, shall thou not be accepted?" It's God saying, "there is still time to change. If you put your heart in the right place, then yeah I would accept your offering. If you don't then you are headed down the wrong path and will likely give in to the evil thoughts and desires of your heart. This will make you a slave to sin so that you will live as if being and doing evil are your only options."
It is interesting to see this thread, was discussing the possible meanings of this mystery with a friend recently.
This is more or less what we were thinking....Adam and Eve together represent mankind, Adam being the Spirit of God, and Eve being the Soul of man. Mankind has already chosen to eat of the Tree of Good and Evil, and are exiled from Eden into duality/dream/illusion. From the union of Adam and Eve, two 'sons' are born, the first being Cain, who represents the concept of separation — ego, and Abel, who represents the birth of God's only Son- Christ.
Cain tilled the soil... the ego works with earthly things, things of the flesh. The separated self believes in survival and the idea of depending on one's own work and effort. This concept is based on lack, an understanding that we must work to create. Cain offers the fruit of his labour to God...these things that the ego offers- our hard work, toil, effort, ability, accomplishment...these things mean nothing to God.
Abel keeps flocks...he is like a steward of the land. He watches over and enjoys what God has made. He offers to God the thoughtful stewardship of the land, what God has given him to enjoy. What he receives is based on gratitude and trust, faith in God's process and our natural abundance. Abel knows that we need do nothing, simply surrender to God's grace and be in harmony with our natural state of abundance. Abel represents the Christ within that is in harmony with All and does not need to toil to enjoy abundance.
God looks on Abel's offering with favour, as it is of spirit and a worthy offering to God, reflecting God's natural abundance and harmony. God can use Abel's offering to extend creation
God looks on at Cain's offering with disfavour, because it is of the ego, and the offering is not worthy of God, representing the ego's need to distinguish itself by separating itself from God (ALL That IS) by its individual actions. Cain's offering is based on lack. God cannot do anything with Cain's offering, as what Cain is doing is contrary to God's natural abundance and harmony.
The ego doesnt like knowing that the fruits of its individual labour are meaningless and not worthy of Creation. It wants to distinguish itself as separate from God. It doesnt want to create in unison with God. The ego is threatened by the Christ, because in essence the ego cannot coexist with the Christ. They are at odds. The ego can only exist if the Christ is repressed. So the ego 'kills' the Christ within and buries Him deep within the garden, out of reach by the everyday senses.
God sees that ego has buried the Christ within, and knows that mankind cannot create like God in this state. He knows that because of ego's actions, mankind will no longer be able to enjoy the natural abundance and harmony of the Earth any more. Instead, mankind will wander the Earth, restlessly in disharmony, believing in lack, toil, disharmony, and separation. Mankind knows that such a 'life' will be short lived, being separated from God, and in disharmony with his environment. So, a 'mark' is placed on the soul of man, so that the mankind may continue to experience Earth through the Law of attraction and Cycle of karma and reincarnation. Cain falls into the dream of projection/illusion to create the world of 'civilisation' on Earth.
Adam and Eve (mankind) then have another son- Seth. I think Seth represents the 'Purushothama', a Soul that incarnates purposefully to show mankind the way back by embodying the Christ Consciousness. This son helps us release the Christ...God's only Son, that is buried within.
This is more or less what we were thinking....Adam and Eve together represent mankind, Adam being the Spirit of God, and Eve being the Soul of man. Mankind has already chosen to eat of the Tree of Good and Evil, and are exiled from Eden into duality/dream/illusion. From the union of Adam and Eve, two 'sons' are born, the first being Cain, who represents the concept of separation — ego, and Abel, who represents the birth of God's only Son- Christ.
Cain tilled the soil... the ego works with earthly things, things of the flesh. The separated self believes in survival and the idea of depending on one's own work and effort. This concept is based on lack, an understanding that we must work to create. Cain offers the fruit of his labour to God...these things that the ego offers- our hard work, toil, effort, ability, accomplishment...these things mean nothing to God.
Abel keeps flocks...he is like a steward of the land. He watches over and enjoys what God has made. He offers to God the thoughtful stewardship of the land, what God has given him to enjoy. What he receives is based on gratitude and trust, faith in God's process and our natural abundance. Abel knows that we need do nothing, simply surrender to God's grace and be in harmony with our natural state of abundance. Abel represents the Christ within that is in harmony with All and does not need to toil to enjoy abundance.
God looks on Abel's offering with favour, as it is of spirit and a worthy offering to God, reflecting God's natural abundance and harmony. God can use Abel's offering to extend creation
God looks on at Cain's offering with disfavour, because it is of the ego, and the offering is not worthy of God, representing the ego's need to distinguish itself by separating itself from God (ALL That IS) by its individual actions. Cain's offering is based on lack. God cannot do anything with Cain's offering, as what Cain is doing is contrary to God's natural abundance and harmony.
The ego doesnt like knowing that the fruits of its individual labour are meaningless and not worthy of Creation. It wants to distinguish itself as separate from God. It doesnt want to create in unison with God. The ego is threatened by the Christ, because in essence the ego cannot coexist with the Christ. They are at odds. The ego can only exist if the Christ is repressed. So the ego 'kills' the Christ within and buries Him deep within the garden, out of reach by the everyday senses.
God sees that ego has buried the Christ within, and knows that mankind cannot create like God in this state. He knows that because of ego's actions, mankind will no longer be able to enjoy the natural abundance and harmony of the Earth any more. Instead, mankind will wander the Earth, restlessly in disharmony, believing in lack, toil, disharmony, and separation. Mankind knows that such a 'life' will be short lived, being separated from God, and in disharmony with his environment. So, a 'mark' is placed on the soul of man, so that the mankind may continue to experience Earth through the Law of attraction and Cycle of karma and reincarnation. Cain falls into the dream of projection/illusion to create the world of 'civilisation' on Earth.
Adam and Eve (mankind) then have another son- Seth. I think Seth represents the 'Purushothama', a Soul that incarnates purposefully to show mankind the way back by embodying the Christ Consciousness. This son helps us release the Christ...God's only Son, that is buried within.
http://www.lifeissues.net/writers/gro/gro_110painofrejection.html
I always thought God acted a bit unfairly, even a bit blood thirstily. Maybe if Cain had brought Able to the sacrifice spot and then clunked him God would have been happy.
Interestingly, the root of the word "bless" is "blood".
[MENTION=4956]charlene[/MENTION] that seems very complex to me. im not sure that most people who have read the bible historically would have possessed the critical apparatus necessary to read the bible in that way. its only very recently that the concept of "ego" has been introduced through Freud's theory. and very few societies have been hunter/gatherer societies in which it is unnecessary to cultivate fields, so that this level of symbolic interpretation is a little bit difficult to reconcile with the hard realities of life. animal husbandry is also a form of cultivation - protecting the animals from wild predators, and deciding which animals will survive to reproduce through generations in order to produce the best stock. karma and reincarnation - dont seem like very Christian like concepts? those ideas are very interesting to think about though, in the context of the bible - and these are just my ideas as a person who is very unfamiliar with Christianity and the bible but is more of a student of texts (especially literary) so my ideas may not be very meaningful.
I think there is a tendency tobinterpret the bible in a pleasing way yo outselves and to interpret the story in such a way as to make God a "good guy". Is that the case? We all hope so. But if I was a stranger to the bible I would interpret this as God was hapoy that Abel took a life as a sacrifice. Vegitation is not worth as much to God (or to humans) like meat is. God was happy that Abel burned up a few days or weeks of his families food/ clothing resource. Which is strange, and goes against logic. Ill write more when I'm not on a cell phone maybe.
[MENTION=1939]Stu[/MENTION] & [MENTION=731]the[/MENTION]
yeah it does not exactly seem as though God wants his people to be vegan!!
yeah it does not exactly seem as though God wants his people to be vegan!!
[MENTION=4956]charlene[/MENTION] you may have been led into the underlying mystery of God in these verses. Be thankful.
Yes it is complex. I should say firstly, that im not a 'Christian', or religious in anyway. I was brought up with Christianity, and have read the Bible a number of times. My faith is all about The Love!
In regards to the 'ego', im not using the concept in the same way as Freud. I use ego in a spiritual context, to describe the concept of separation/fear/lack.
In regards to the Bible, i dont believe that it is a book that is to be taken literally. The Bible is full of stories that are mysteries. Spiritual Truths are hidden in plain sight in these stories, and they contain the Word of God. Sometimes it gets confusing because these stories can be taken very literally, and we can get lost in the detail. Throw in religion, authority, issues of power and control, and things get very confusing. The stories than become more about the details, using fear and guilt to maipulate people, and creating 'god' in man's image.
When i first read the Bible, i did take these stories literally, and consequently, i was very confused.
The other day when i was discussing the 'cain and abel' story with my friend....we were washing the dishes, and we could smell the neighbours dinner cooking- animal flesh being charred. We found it interesting that we use to enjoy the smell of 'meat' cooking so much, and now we found it somewhat repulsive.
It made me think of when I was a little kid first being taught Bible stories. As a kid I found it disturbing that 'God' liked the smell of burning flesh so much. Especially when I was told by the good folks at church that one day all the people that refused to serve Him would burn in an eternal lake of fire. Being a kid, the concept of eternal punishment made no sense at all, and I assumed that it was probably because He liked the smell of burning flesh so much.
Anyway, talking about this got us talking about the Cain and Abel story, and the idea that 'God somehow preferred animals over vegetables from the beginning. After we laughed about this for a while, a story started coming together about what this particular mystery could really be about.
I hope i havent offended anyone with my thoughts...i believe that all religions/cultures from all over the world hold mysteries for seekers.