Speaking "from behind" anyone? | INFJ Forum

Speaking "from behind" anyone?

LucyJr

LucyJr

Well-known member
Aug 10, 2013
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I call speaking from behind when a person is speaking but not fully sincere, but from a "back" psychological place, to observe and watch the reactions of people in real time.
Anyone can recognise what I'm describing?
I've been noticing this is true especialy for INFJs.
Usualy people speaking and acting like this have a apathic life, that lacks spontaneity and natural emotional "flow", because they subdue and restrain their spontaneity in order to get the full out of this psychological approach.


What do you think it is? Do you think it comes from fear, or from a moral disfunctionality, like a lack of honesty?
 
Would someone who hates INFJ's going to a forum set up for INFJ's and then posting anti-INFJ hate propaganda be an example of someone speaking 'from behind'?

You'd think that a forum set up for INFJ's would be the last place someone who hates iNFJ's would want to spend time but amazingly some still do it!

Maybe their lives lack spontenaity and emotional flow and thats why they behave in such a dysfunctional way
 
Thank you, muir. That needed to be said. lucy jr, please stop defecating in our garden. I'm tired of having to watch out for your piles.
 
taoisnow said:
lucy jr, please stop defecating in our garden. I'm tired of having to watch out for your piles.
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Well... wait, I think he can have his say. If he's totally off base, I don't think it's hard to ignore him. But if he's only a little and is honestly asking a question, I don't mind answering, personally, and respect discussion. That's the point of a forum, after all, even one dedicated to INFJ or any other thing. Also, many forums have the capability to set up a block list or ignore list and, if that's how you feel about [MENTION=9401]LucyJr[/MENTION] in general, it is pretty easy to do.

All that having been said...

LucyJr said:
I call speaking from behind when a person is speaking but not fully sincere, but from a "back" psychological place, to observe and watch the reactions of people in real time.
Anyone can recognise what I'm describing?
I've been noticing this is true especialy for INFJs.
Usualy people speaking and acting like this have a apathic life, that lacks spontaneity and natural emotional "flow", because they subdue and restrain their spontaneity in order to get the full out of this psychological approach.


What do you think it is? Do you think it comes from fear, or from a moral disfunctionality, like a lack of honesty?
Click to expand...

You lost me when you went from questioning to generalizing. I guess if that is the answer you are comfortable with to your own question, then fine. But if you asked it in a forum I would assume you are interested in other answers as well.

I think what you are talking about is insincere "shock" statements. [MENTION=1871]muir[/MENTION] made a very excellent and subtle point: that your own answer may be a good example of what you're talking about.

Beyond that, though, there's been a lot of articles written trying to understand what psychological affectation causes "Internet trolls", and I can say I'm still utterly baffled by it. Why does someone feel the need to categorically trash what someone else has said or done online without actually addressing what they have said or done online? Are these people getting some sort of pleasure from the superiority of being able to say horrible things anonymously? Are they, in fact, compensating for an "apathic life"? Do they have such fixed generalizations about others that, in the midst of cognitive dissonance, they lash out rather than listen and think?

But I really dislike the idea that this behavior can be attributed directly to an MBTI type. First off, you're probably giving undue approval or consideration to the MBTI types. I really don't think they are as concrete as that "most INFJ's have this horrible behavior or do these terrible things". But second, a specific behavior like this, especially one that can be seen as odious and unjustified, goes along more with a psychological condition that has little to nothing to do with personality. You would never say "INFJs tend to be schizophrenic" for instance, or "INFJs tend to have autism" etc. The condition of schizophrenia or autism has nothing at all to do with personality, or if it does, it is a separate consideration that plays on the personality, not from it.

That's my take. Interested in discussion, as I said, but not generalizations.
 
LucyJr said:
I call speaking from behind when a person is speaking but not fully sincere, but from a "back" psychological place, to observe and watch the reactions of people in real time.
Anyone can recognise what I'm describing?
I've been noticing this is true especialy for INFJs.
Click to expand...

A skew on this I experience from certain INTPs who inquire for their own "amusement", and without any interest in contributing
 
Dave Fallon said:
Well... wait, I think he can have his say. If he's totally off base, I don't think it's hard to ignore him. But if he's only a little and is honestly asking a question, I don't mind answering, personally, and respect discussion. That's the point of a forum, after all, even one dedicated to INFJ or any other thing. Also, many forums have the capability to set up a block list or ignore list and, if that's how you feel about [MENTION=9401]LucyJr[/MENTION] in general, it is pretty easy to do.

All that having been said...



You lost me when you went from questioning to generalizing. I guess if that is the answer you are comfortable with to your own question, then fine. But if you asked it in a forum I would assume you are interested in other answers as well.

I think what you are talking about is insincere "shock" statements. [MENTION=1871]muir[/MENTION] made a very excellent and subtle point: that your own answer may be a good example of what you're talking about.

Beyond that, though, there's been a lot of articles written trying to understand what psychological affectation causes "Internet trolls", and I can say I'm still utterly baffled by it. Why does someone feel the need to categorically trash what someone else has said or done online without actually addressing what they have said or done online? Are these people getting some sort of pleasure from the superiority of being able to say horrible things anonymously? Are they, in fact, compensating for an "apathic life"? Do they have such fixed generalizations about others that, in the midst of cognitive dissonance, they lash out rather than listen and think?

But I really dislike the idea that this behavior can be attributed directly to an MBTI type. First off, you're probably giving undue approval or consideration to the MBTI types. I really don't think they are as concrete as that "most INFJ's have this horrible behavior or do these terrible things". But second, a specific behavior like this, especially one that can be seen as odious and unjustified, goes along more with a psychological condition that has little to nothing to do with personality. You would never say "INFJs tend to be schizophrenic" for instance, or "INFJs tend to have autism" etc. The condition of schizophrenia or autism has nothing at all to do with personality, or if it does, it is a separate consideration that plays on the personality, not from it.

That's my take. Interested in discussion, as I said, but not generalizations.
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Ok, so if I understood correctly, what you are saying is that this type of behaviour is specific to autistic and schizoprenic people?
 
If I am understanding your question correctly, this is something that I do. It's what happens when you don't empathize with another person's situation but understand that perhaps that person needs some empathy. A lot of what I say to people IRL is insincere. I find that I don't really care much for their emotional state and don't want to deal with it, but will engage in conversation that causes a reaction from them. It can be very manipulative but it doesn't come from a place of malice. It comes from a desire to drive change without considering a person's current emotional state.
 
SpecialEdition said:
If I am understanding your question correctly, this is something that I do. It's what happens when you don't empathize with another person's situation but understand that perhaps that person needs some empathy. A lot of what I say to people IRL is insincere. I find that I don't really care much for their emotional state and don't want to deal with it, but will engage in conversation that causes a reaction from them. It can be very manipulative but it doesn't come from a place of malice. It comes from a desire to drive change without considering a person's current emotional state.
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Interesting. Have you thought that maybe you are a Aspie, like it has been suggested in this thread?
 
LucyJr said:
Interesting. Have you thought that maybe you are a Aspie, like it has been suggested in this thread?
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No. I don't fall anywhere on the Autism Spectrum and I don't seem to have social issues like a person with Aspbergers might. I don't have any trouble socializing both online or in the real world. I am also not an internet troll.
 
LucyJr said:
Ok, so if I understood correctly, what you are saying is that this type of behaviour is specific to autistic and schizoprenic people?
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No. I'm sorry you misunderstood.

I liked [MENTION=7838]SpecialEdition[/MENTION] 's take on this and I appreciate her candor.
 
SpecialEdition said:
No. I don't fall anywhere on the Autism Spectrum and I don't seem to have social issues like a person with Aspbergers might. I don't have any trouble socializing both online or in the real world. I am also not an internet troll.
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Pretty girls can't be aspie. Duuuhhhh
 
Oh please. You speak as if only one type in particular does this in all situation and circumstances. XD
 
LucyJr said:
I call speaking from behind when a person is speaking but not fully sincere, but from a "back" psychological place, to observe and watch the reactions of people in real time.
Anyone can recognise what I'm describing?
I've been noticing this is true especialy for INFJs.
Usualy people speaking and acting like this have a apathic life, that lacks spontaneity and natural emotional "flow", because they subdue and restrain their spontaneity in order to get the full out of this psychological approach.


What do you think it is? Do you think it comes from fear, or from a moral disfunctionality, like a lack of honesty?
Click to expand...

I think everyone does this. I call it the mask we all wear. It is socially conditioned and we all had time in our lives to cultivate the image and behavior we wish to exhibit and yes it is not the same as who you are on the inside. I don't see it as lack of honesty or not being open. Being too open is risky and being too guarded is too safe. We all try to find a balance and yes for the most part spontaneity and being gregarious in society can be seen as a weakness. Projection of ourselves is completely dependent on personal motivations. I think INFJs have a special desire to break this mask and be accepted for our vulnerability and sensitivity without filtering; but that does not work because it is rather idealistic in a society that favors bold extraversion.
 
To go along perhaps with what [MENTION=7838]SpecialEdition[/MENTION] has said I do not care much for people's emotional state myself. Having read about it, it seems that intjs do not know what to do with raw emotion and I think this holds true in my case. I too may converse in a way with a person who insisted on talking to me about an emotionally charge issue or problem in a way that would get them to look at it from a perspective that I think would help. One that perhaps they themselves could not see.
Emotions make me feel a bit like a bull in a china shop. I believe I possess empathy in a way that allows me to see that a person is in need of help but not in a way that allows me to understand how to do anything about it. I cant "feel" their pain in other words. I think though I can feel sadness that they are experiencing something that is difficult for them to process and move past. My only course then is to try and help in the only way I know how. Cold rational logic.
 
i care deeply about what other people feel, and i get physically unwell if i cause them to feel uncomfortable. i constantly have an emotional antenna up to try and pick up on underlying feelings and meanings behind what people say. i sometimes have a tendency to "people please" in order to avoid confrontations, but with time i've found that the kindest thing to do is to just be honest in a caring way.

i have on occasion done and said terrible thing to people to get their reactions, but that's human behavior though. every one goes through a period of pushing the boundaries to find out what's acceptable and what's unacceptable.

edith (or "edit"): i don't think that i've done this more than the norm. in fact, i think that i've done it less than average.
 
Lol. Lucy Jr. £INFP. You're life is great. I'd love to have it, probably. Especially the social life. You're actually probably one of the more luckier ones. Most others are sad.

£ because hash tags are so overrated. (And there is that fact that the hash tag symbol got switched on my computer because the boot disk was British.)
 
Oh my gosh, I've just experienced this tonight.

I was on the phone w/ m mother(ESTP) and she was talking about how inconsiderate my older sister (INFP) was, bla bla bla, I tried tot tell her why my sister acts the way she does THEN my sister came and told me how my mom takes her emotions out on her, bla bla bla and tried to explain to her that she wouldn't just flip out on her for no reason and told her why she acts the way she does, but they're both stubborn and don't consider each others viewpoints!

I wanted to care so I just sat back and listened and acted like I did, but really I just wanted to hang up and walk the fuck off!
 
Hrrm. Well, I don't know. Surprised that people reacted so poorly to LucyJr. Must be the name. I'll be back with the answer as to why.
 
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